Opinion on new GT3 BOP changes

hello metalogic,

the car do drive same as before and feel same and it is still competive and fun to drive.
they did (from my testing) little more fuel need the car give (what was needed), but not much,
the reduce power is very not much (if they did?) , i did not realy feel it in laptimes, maximal 0.2 seconds i would say, but can be, that car is same fast too, very hard to judge at the moment.
the changes are very little only and you will not feel it.
so sector3 did not kill the car, like it was with ford gt3 cars with Bop before this BoP.
nothing to worry with porsche.

servus

 

Good to see that Georg struggling around too with the M6 at his BOP livestream yesterday. Even 40% TC didn't helped him.
I could drive with 5% TC on Nürburgring before the update, now >20% and he is still hard to control.
Bad on the brakes, understeering and now no more traction.

 

Thanks Reinhard, good to know! How much Traction Control do you run the GT3 Porsche with?

 

hello matalogic,

think very close to orginal, around 10% i think, the 1st setting, i never change TC level during the race.
car do drive identical easy after BoP, no different i did feel with TC.

servus

 

So, I've been driving my a$$ off in the last few days to see if I can gain anything from the new BoP for the M6. No way. If the intention was to make the car a tad faster then unfortunately I must conclude this was a fail. My laptimes at Spa didn't change a bit. And I tried different approaches with high or low wing settings, ride height...whatever you can think of.

Yes, it's a bit faster on the straights, but most of this is - in my opinion - not due to the slightly increased power, but more due to the fact that with downforce also the drag has been reduced. I noticed that you can now turn the rearwing up quite a bit without losing in topspeed a lot. Sadly this doesn't help very much, because downforce is so low that you can't pull any advantage out of it.

To be honest, I'm a bit puzzled. If the M6 really is such a tank with 1.300 kg, how on earth do they get this thing BoPed in real life?

I always loved the M6 for its BMW-typical balance. BMWs are mostly built to have a 50:50 weight distibution which makes them very neutral to drive. This is somewhat gone now. Well, not really as the M6 has neither grip at the front nor at the rear now. It's just extremely twitchy compared to the other GT3s and not even fast being so twitchy. Before the last BoP it was exactly this fast (or slow) but at least it was very stable. If I had the choice I'd rather have back the old one.

 

Yes I've also spent some time today tweaking the M6 to make it somewhat driveable, and I got it down to a 2:18:0 at Spa (2:17:7 possible) which is what I was getting out of it pre-patch, where it was stable as a rock and easy to drive, now it's a twitchy animal..

As Arthur says, it has a better top speed now but at low speed now it's just a pig. Feels like the torque curve was adjusted to cover for the low end lack of power. I'd welcome the previous M6 BOP back too (though fixing it would be preferred)

Brakes are still trash.

 

Looks at M6 at Bathurst 12hr, pole position, stable over bumps, smooth power delivery.

Looks at M6 in raceroom.

Shakes head disapprovingly.

 

yeah the M6 is an under powered mess when it should be on par with other GT3's on fast flowing tracks, not sure what happened with the bop update.

 

I think you may be right with the M6. It was my call to reduce downforce, since during testing, the car became the fastest car with the corrected engine and it allowed for some crazy cornerspeeds, but it was probably overdone a bit, sorry. Also with the C7R, maybe we slowed it down a tad too much.

BoP is hard! You see it in real life too!

 

Managed to make a setup that's reasonably fast at Spa (2:16:5) but still over a second behind the faster cars, and i'm fairly sure it's not a reasonable setup for racing as it needs to be powersliding to keep the speed up.

M6 however, seems so far to be reasonably competitive at Bathurst.

 

Please don't increase the downforce.... Hahha I'd take it lower if I could.

I think it needs an adjustment to the base setup, probably. And I still think it needs adjustment to the brakes (personally) but with the right setup it does appear to be...reasonable.. over a single lap time. I'll see if I can keep adjusting it to make a more stable base setup.

BoP is indeed extremely difficult, i'd wager outright impossible to cater for the variety of driving styles, variety of setups and the number and variety of circuits.

 

Nice to hear that you are so responsive to BoP concerns. I just started so I am by no means fast but I have been working with the Callaway Corvette on Mid-Ohio for a couple days because Mid-Ohio is a track I know and have actually driven in real life. Imagine my surprise when I surpassed my best lap time for the C7 on my third lap with my newly acquired Porsche 911 GT3 R. Now admittedly, I am still learning the dynamics of R3E but IMO that Porsche is a bit fast compared to the Callaway. It is good that you acknowledge that the C7 might have been slowed a bit too much. Now I need to work with my set-up on the Corvette to see if I can get it back in front of the 911.

 

I just hope my "review" didn't come over too harsh. I surely was a bit disappointed that the M6 is not yet quite where I want it to be, but this is no reason to feel sorry for you.

I think we all know it's hard to balance these cars, especially since the new physics bring out the different characteristics alot better than before. The whole class feels a lot more alive with the new physics and I'm sure you will make a good balance in the end after a few further iterations. And whatever changes you make, you can never know what the aliens and setup gurus out there will do with it. It's a process of try and error.

The team has always done a superb job in balancing different cars and you will surely do it again. It just needs a bit of time.

 

I think it's fantastic that your keeping an eye on bop . Very progressive.
I usually drive with low wing anyway but to me something seems different beyond reinforce with the m6. It was the first I believe of the new cars and it was fast and stable but now it is very difficult to drive. Maybe it is low front downforce or stability.

Keep up the great work. Live these gt3 cars. Pretty soon you'll be working on the m8

 

Just finished a punishing night racing with G. Ortner and others on Gamer Muscle's stream. Spent the whole night 0.4 to 0.9 behind G. Ortner in the Porsche.

BMW is competitive enough, but still lacking something to eek those last tenths out of it, still think it's held back by the brakes.

Had the wing set to 7 degrees all night, would have dropped it lower given the chance.

 

After Porsche added , I checked all GT3 cars one by one.

This is OLD BOP data. checked by me.

Heavyweight.
Accelerated growth to the top end is wonderful, handling is bad.
CHEVROLET CAMARO GT3
Ford MUSTANG GT3

Middleweight.
Acceleration performance is very good, handling is quite heavy.
BENTLEY CONTINENTAL GT3
CHEVROLET CORVETTE Z06.R GT3
CALLAWAY CORVETTE C7 GT3-R
Nissan GT-R GT3
Mercedes AMG GT3
Mercedes - Benz SLS AMG GT 3

lightweight.
handling Performance is good, but uncertainty remains in the growth of top speed.
MCLAREN 650 S GT3
MCLAREN MP4-12C GT3
AUDI R8 LMS
Audi R8 LMS Ultra
BMW M6 GT3

It is super lightweight.
With light body and light handling, cornering performance is very good, but you can not expect top speed growth.
P4/5 COMPETIZIONE
Porsche 911 GT3
RUF RT12R GTR3

It was an insufficient machine for performance adjustment, which was disadvantageous.
Handling is not good and growth of acceleration to the top end is not good either.
BMW Z4 GT3
BMW ALPINA B6 GT3
Ford GT GT3
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<My opinion>
I can understand that a little power was given to the lowpwer GT3cars.
It was straight and clearly disadvantageous.
I think the old GT3 is slow, but it is realistic.

However, Porsche which is very excellent in cornering performance gave extra power. Porsche became a new king.

Corvette C6R is an old GT3 car. It is natural that performance is too high.
However, the Corvette C7R is the newest racing car. Performance adjustment is not necessary.

BoP also understands that it is difficult.
With several updates, justice and better BoP!

 

IMO the BoP is getting closer at the moment.

The feeling from a few races I had since the update:
Porsche 911 GT3R looks a little bit to fast now.
Corvette C7R maybe lacks a bit in power but really only a little bit.
BMW M6 GT3 maybe needs a little bit in downforce in front to get it's neutral feeling back so that every (quote from Sabine Schmitz) "trained monkey" can drive it.

 

After some more testing and doing some public races in the M6 I came to the conclusion that it really isn't the wings that's holding it back a little.

The most famous example I came across is this last corner at Zandvoort. As long as you enter it right you still can easily go full throttle through there. Other cars can too, but at least the other guys in their AMGs seemed to not be able. I always gained a slightly little bit there on otherwise similar paced drivers in AMGs.

It's not a lot but shows that it's not the wings, the M6 seems quite good in the middle in this department. Over a lap I'm still faster in an AMG compared to the M6. So far I didn't try a track where this was different and maybe I just drove the wrong tracks, but the gap was about half a second at least. Since the M6 is fast enough on the straights and through fast corners, the time seems to get lost elsewhere. The engine got buffed at the lower revs, so it's most probably also not due to lack of power out of slow corners.

I really think now that it's the weight. Having to brake comparably early is quite obvious on the M6. But the weight looks like to be just a reality of this car. So it shouldn't be touched. Dunno what to do...

 

Audi is the best car... second AMG

https://www.autosport.be/news/gt3-awards-de-meest-succesvolle-constructeurs-in-2017.html