Feedback on [BETA] - RANKED servers

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Stickdeath1980, Dec 18, 2019.

  1. Vale

    Vale Well-Known Member

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    Yes, but don´t expect them to give you a rebate on lost rating points!
     
  2. Paul Darke

    Paul Darke Moderator Beta tester

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    Unfortunately yes. There is no way of knowing the difference between an electricity/internet outage and someone just pulling out the plug in anger.
     
  3. Larry Foster

    Larry Foster Member

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    @Joel Willstein Well sir I envy the Fanatec 3 pedal set but I still have my trusty Thrustmaster T3PA Pro pedals with a Ricmotech Load cell installed. But I am looking to possibly move up to the Fanatec set
     
  4. Hervé45

    Hervé45 Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    Hello
    many crash on dtm92 at zolder
     

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  5. SuperMonacoGP

    SuperMonacoGP Member

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    hi all, last days I begin to race online in r3e but it seems that all ranked servers - at least here in europe - are completely dead empty. the only ones with some people in it are the ones that requires reputation, which i obviously can't get if i can't find any server with actual people in it.
    so, the idea of ranked servers is great, i deeply love r3e but i ask myself what is the point of that if nobody is actually racing those servers.
    cheers from italy
    sector 3 rocks :)
     
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  6. OldFart

    OldFart Active Member

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    From experience of all servers and I run up to five; very few will join empty servers full stop, and select the option not to see them, Join one even empty, do not leave once in qualifying, Pick a busy time, and people will join, Anyone with a high rank will stay away from zero rank servers as the risk of damage to their own ranking is much higher, Remember you start your first ranked game with a base score of 75 that will go up or down dependent on your race, so yes you start with 0 when you enter your first race first but can leave with 75 plus
     
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  7. carlos de hoz

    carlos de hoz Member

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    Formatee la PC y reinstale el juego, y perdí mis puntos:(
     
  8. TheOutdriver97

    TheOutdriver97 Well-Known Member

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    I have to say I agree with Alex, the ranked servers certainly seem emptier than they used to be.

    I really enjoy playing WTCR and at points earlier in the year the ranked server regularly had 20 or so players in. Now I often find myself taking one for the team and sitting there through a practice session just to get a lobby going but even then struggle to get anyone.

    GTR3 seems to have dropped from full lobbies to single figures as well.
     
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  9. William Richardson

    William Richardson Active Member

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    Before the big update I raced over at sim racing systems, raceroom had some pretty thin fields then. I don't play the game anymore, and I don't even see raceroom listed in the daily schedule.
     
  10. ndwthx1138

    ndwthx1138 Well-Known Member

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    I've played an embarrassing amount of races on the ranked servers during the last couple months (I only do ranked or private/invite races). I'm currently ranked in top 5 (number 2 at the moment, which I can assure you does not mean I am the 2nd fastest). Here are some of my thoughts on how to improve the experience-

    Make off track incidents actually mean something -
    People have become experts at figuring how many invalid laps (red) they can do in a single session. Often times all the laps are invalid and no valid lap times are every reported. This gives people a huge advantage for cheating. The slow down function seemingly does not work or isn't deployed on the ranked servers. I've watched top 20 ranked people run very wide lap after lap to catch up to someone obeying the rules/track.
    In a 20 minutes race - After 4 off track incidents you get a 1.5 second slow down penalty. 7 incidents is a drive through. These numbers must be relative to the race duration.

    Reduce incident points allowed relative to time.
    I know this is already the case but it's way too high. I suggest 1 per minute. 20 minute race - 20 incident points allowed (that's being generous in my opinion, if you want to play wreckfest - go play wreckfest). You offer a great single player experience, go learn to drive the track/car before ruining other peoples experience.

    Less reductions for podium finishes.
    As you get higher on the leader boards coming in second can mean you lose several points. I really don't think this makes any sense. 2nd place should not be a deduction. Honestly I don't think a podium finish should be a reduction in points period. This certainly keeps me away from certain ranked servers. I want competitive races but should I really be losing rating for coming in 2nd or 3rd to someone who's ranked 8th? I understand not gaining for certain conditions. But losing rating creates a situation where people won't want to risk/compete.

    Crashes - doesn't seem like this is something that wants to be addressed. At this point with the servers showing so few drivers - it might be worth trying. Again if there was a major penalty for large differences in speed during a collusion we could greatly reduce wreckers time on track. If your speed is over 25kph at the moment of collusion you get double the incident points (8) and the guy going slower gets half (2). Yes, people could take advantage of this (someone waiting a lap down for example), but easy enough - white flag removes this rule. Yes people might brake check - but if you get 2 points (rather than 4) and run the incredible risk of ending up backwards on track - that seems like enough of a deterrent for the masses. Let be inventive, iracing has failed at this for its entire run. It at least has a system for calling out bad players, but requires human-being time to evaluate and judge which can't be cheap and is seriously time consuming. It can be better and on a budget.

    Qualifying - Practice
    Make qualifying time matter more, anyone who leaves gets minus 1/2 a rating point, pole sitter gets 1 rating point. When the server were active a few weeks back you would find all the fast people sand bagging their times so people would not leave before the race starts. It took me awhile to figure this out (and had to ask a few folks why their race times were 1-3 seconds faster than their qualify time). I still see people who literally don't drive a single lap in practice or qualifying. People sitting doing nothing for practice and qualifying - then leaving 2 minutes before a race because they know they are not fast enough to be competitive is terrible and a waste of time/bandwidth. Formula Jr is my favorite example- 16 people in practice with 1-2 people actually doing laps. Then qualifying happens and you end up with maybe 5 drivers at the end. This is common place in raceroom.

    Lastly - and indirectly - add a persons rating and reputation to their user page. This seems like a absolute no brainer. I would love to check during qualifying/practice what someones reputation is, do I need to be cautious as this fast guy has a D- safety rating?

    nathanw
     
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  11. yoori

    yoori Well-Known Member

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    I don't fully agree wtih thhose ideas.

    Make off track incidents actually mean something
    Regarding cut track penalties, if they worked correctly there would not be a need for your idea. If every offtrack that gains you time was penalised with a slowdown, then there wouldn't be any exploits. If you see people exploit track boundaries report it.

    Less reductions for podium finishes.
    You lost to someone with a lower rating ,hence you lost a small amount, that's how the ELO system works and it's fair IMO.

    Crashes
    Your Idea would be exploited like hell, but you're on to something. The distribution of point has to be equal.

    I would like to see a gradation of penalities for contacts. The force of impact is measured so it could be that
    - for a harmless paint trading there is only 1 point, the amount of points increases with the force of impact
    - multiplier for the outcome of the contact. If the result of impact is a spin or going off track or damage to the car the number of points could be increased.
    - contacts under yellow flag should be also give extra points.
    - not slowing down under yellow should give incident points.

    There would have to be a way to actually prevent wreckers for joining races, but that's the case now anyway.

    Qualifying - Practice
    There's a million reason someone would have to leave in practice or quali giving penalty would be too harsh.
    If the system is too harsh/unfair, people would just stop racing, this is what I think is happening now. At least in my case.
     
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  12. ndwthx1138

    ndwthx1138 Well-Known Member

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    Well basically I disagree with nearly everything you said. We will just have to disagree.

    However I do think you have a few good opinions

    - if off track gains resulted in a time penality, then it would be great. It’s been 5 months and for some reason the cut rule - slow down - doesn’t work on ranked servers. Red Bull and Portimao are so bad that you can gain over a second for 10 laps straight without a penality or DQ. I’ve reported and shown this numerous times as have others. Reporting it did nothing. So I think we agree on the point that it would be ideal if off track gains were penalized. I’d actually rather see your thought work - but if sector 3 doesn’t want to have working slow downs in ranked servers then incident points need to mean something.

    Agree with you - yellow flags. Good suggestion / incident point for not slowing, additional incident points for contact under yellow. Both great suggestions in my opinion.

    I completely disagree with your view on collisions points being equal. Having a system that victimizes people doing the right thing is awful, disheartening and turns people away. I myself stopped playing after a wrecker crashed me out, pitted to fix his car so he could crash other people out, all while being several laps down. The system does not have a automated way to prevent wreckers in any real capacity - especially with an allowance of 20-30 incident points in a race. Having a list of people that require a human to report it, another to note it, another to implement is not affective or timely.

    Lastly - jumping out of practice - no penalty - no problem. Jumping out of a closed qualifying session as you wait to see what everyone’s time is so you know - this is a race I can win - a problem I see literally every time I play.
     
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  13. yoori

    yoori Well-Known Member

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    I've been stewarding races for a league. It is really hard for a human to assign fault. It wouuld be even harder to code a fair automatic system. I'm not saying even split is good, but the possible / realistic alternatives are worse.

    Every system you could come up with could be exploited and as a result wrecker would have high rep, while other would be punished. My ideas could possibly be exploited or harfull. The bottom line is, intentional wrcekers will drop faster than others. If the system worked like it should those people would not be allowed into the servers and the servers would be cleaner.

    I've already proposed on discord to allow rep gains/drops on non ranked servers, where max rep you can get in non ranked ones is let's say 70. Then ranked servers would have a min rep requirement of 70 or higher. With starting rep below 70 people would have to earn the possibility to race ranked servers and would have to be clean on non rankesd servers as well to maintain rep. People that for some reason drop below 70 have a chance to regain their rep without affecting their rating.
     
  14. Lixma

    Lixma Honorary QA

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    Thinking out loud here, but what if ranking was an opt-in feature for online players?

    The player could then join any server they fancy, have a race, and at the end their performance, incidents, etc could be uploaded to the GIANT BRAIN and their ranking updated. This would help the problem of empty ranked servers.

    Obviously if you care about your ranking you're likely to avoid the bloodbath servers, but there's loads of non-official servers, including leagues, that are just as concerned about clean racing as the players using official ranked servers.

    edit: and yoori beat me to it
     
  15. Andi Goodwin

    Andi Goodwin Moderator Beta tester

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    and i only upload my good results ?

    Andi
     
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  16. SuperMonacoGP

    SuperMonacoGP Member

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    hi all, so 2 days ago I managed to find an european ranked server with 6 people in it.
    did the race, finished 3rd - my 1st ever ranked race - with no incidents.
    at this point I thought I would have find more servers from that moment on.
    tonight I looked again for a ranked euro server, I found just one with 1 guy in it. one guy.
    I honestly don't know what else I can do.
     
  17. Lixma

    Lixma Honorary QA

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    No, everything gets uploaded automatically - the good, the bad, the ugly - only difference is you're being ranked whichever server you're in.
     
  18. Arthur Spooner

    Arthur Spooner Well-Known Member

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    People would exploit this by making up their own pw-locked servers and rank up on them with very short races, probably driving around all alone - just to get access to servers with limited reputation access and be able to go wrecking again. Additionally bad ranking-experiences on some random servers would skyrocket compared to now. If you opt-in to ranking, but most others don't, all others also don't care about ranking and drive accordingly. And then people would all come to the forums and whine along about how bad it all is. I really don't wanna see this.

    To maintain some kind of a stable environment, ranked servers should stay in the hands of Sector3 I think.

    But I also agree that the recent emptyness of the ranked servers needs to be dealt with. But people are also way too concerned about their ranking and reputation points. If you lost a few it's pretty easy to get them back as long as you don't do any stupid stuff. I also had a bad race recently where I collected something like close to 30 incident points and my reputation went down as little as 1.1 points. And I don't even have a lot of ranked races under my belt - 35 upto now.
     
  19. Henrik Fredborg

    Henrik Fredborg New Member

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    Dec 12, 2019
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    My main reasons for not joining ranked servers anymore, (I mainly race on GT3 servers):
    - Track rotation seems very limited. Where are the newest released tracks like Dubai and Daytona? I don't want to race on Suzuka and Imola all the time when we have other quality tracks to chose from. Is it because no one buys the new tracks?

    - Lack of close and interesting racing. Usually I am in the middle to fast section of drivers but over a 20 min. race you rarely have close fighting with anyone since their pace varies wildly now. Another reason is that half the field is usually DNF. This was of course better a few months ago with more drivers on the servers.

    - Not sure I like the practice sessions and no joining during qual. Why not go back to 20 min. qual and 20 min. race. If I don't time my online racing I have to wait 30 minutes for the GT3 server to open up for a new race. In these cases I go racing offline instead.

    Also, may I suggest some more promotion for the ranked servers on the front page of Raceroom. Seems plenty of people play in the competitions which are often promoted there.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2020
  20. OldFart

    OldFart Active Member

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    I think the lack of people on ranked servers is part of the bigger problem; and that is much lower numbers on the servers in general. I have for a long time (until this week, it is not worth it anymore) run up to five servers covering most types of cars and tracks, It was not unusual to see two or three full throughout the busy times, now it can be days and nothing at all, as a example Daytona was released I put it on first rotation on all servers, two days nothing not one race started, so one evening I counted nineteen servers including a couple of ranked ones, twenty three players, that is all, checked again over the next couple of days,similar numbers with a couple of exceptions when one server had a near full grid, not ranked, clearly I cant watch all the time so only a snapshot, but telling all the same
     
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    Last edited: Jun 4, 2020