I haven´t used a wheel or controller on AMS2 yet so can´t judge but in RRE 8 degrees was not enough for wheel or joystick but OK if I used the digital buttons on a controller to steer. My point is that both games use a default low angle when using digital input but that the other settings come into play too as do the way the physics work - in AMS2 you can throttle steer more easily to help turn the car. Track grip is also different and in AMS2 you can run on a green track or with rain. In RRE I normally use 9 or 10 degrees at the most with 25% sensitivity and 75 speed, so quite close to default. In AMS2 default settings were impossible (a car like the GT3 911 would spin out on a straight) I am between 16 and 18 degrees with around 90 speed sensitivity and 95 damping. This PC2 vid also suggests a setup with lower speed sensitivity but I find that too snappy in AMS2. I will check what I have in PC1 as I don´t own PC2.
Tbh, either something is off with the steering lock, or nobody really knows how it works exactly, because I've been asking about it twice now, both on the public and beta forums and I haven't received a proper answer to it. I also would like to know how we should calculate the correct value.
Interesting, I don't experience this at all. How much I can steer is more or less similar on a keyboard and on a wheel. There's one undocumented feature in R3E though. If you're using digital controls and your speed is low enough, your steering lock should increase. Maybe that explains it? Although by default it only works at speeds below 20 km/h, you can change this range in your .rcs file, the line is "Steer Ratio Speed". (But I don't know if this feature even works or simply a leftover from earlier games.) 14 degrees is not low at all, it's only a tad bit lower than steering lock in real racing cars. But these cars have steering range of 450+ degrees and never go even close to full lock while racing (except at the likes of Monaco or Macau). 14 degrees on a track is too much. But probably that's okay if the game has speed sensitive steering and simply doesn't steer that far when you're driving.
For me the issue is that the 8 lock in raceroom is not the real value for the angle the front wheels turn from centre in degrees. To go round a sharp 180 hairpin bend like in Macau or Monaco it would be like a supertanker. Even on an oval, you´d need more than that to move out of the pits if a car is in front. If I use a wheel then 8 is useless as it takes so long to get from centre to full lock that the corner has already passed and counter steering is also impossible. It´s one of the reasons I am faster on keys than with wheel or analogue controller. Road cars typically have about 30-40 degrees with FWD cars limited by their CV joints. The London taxi may have as much as 45. Struggling to find the lock on a GT3 but I guess between 20 and 25 as an F1 apparently runs about 21 to go round Monaco and 17 normally. What I am getting at is that these lock values in neither game are real life values and seem just to be a scale from min to max. 14 degrees in AMS2 won´t get any car round the hairpin at Cadwell Park except maybe a Mini If you are using a wheel then 14 is only going to be maximum lock so I guess the solution is to reduce the directness of the wheel rotation so that small inputs give low response or indeed the speed sensitivity one should be increased as I do in AMS2. Damping would seem to be the one that makes a digital device act like a wheel by diluting input effects at all speeds. The hidden feature in RRE you mention, is that separate from speed sensitive steering? That is in the RRE game menu and you can adjust the minimum and maximum speeds it takes effect so I don´t get why there would be a second option to do the same. I´ll check it out after lunch.
PC1 has the same sliders but controls and/or settings work a bit differently there. In my game the default values were 65/0 and controls were more usable and less twitchy than in PC2 and AMS2 (which have defaults like 90/65? can't remember). More or less okay (for me) settings in PC2 were something around 80/100, in AMS2 - 100/100. Here you're talking about extreme cases for which, of course, 8 degrees won't be enough. But simply driving around tracks (which is what we do 99,9% of the time), 8 is enough for most tracks. For some you would need 9 and then there's a few that need even more. I believe what we see in R3E (if you hook up a wheel) is more or less realistic values. Looks like ACC and rF2 (official GT3 cars) have similar values, usually 15-20 degrees. Yes, separate from that. I was under impression that speed sensitive steering only works for gamepads. But I didn't test it so I don't know.
I like to use the realistic steering rotation for all cars, so I set the maximum rotation in the driver (1080 degrees) and let the sims set the realistic angle with the soft lock. BUT AMS2 does not show the exact rotation of the individual cars, I always have to check it inside the car (trying to measure the angle with the soft lock). For example I was struggling with the Porsche GT3, unitl I noticed that unlike the other GT3s, it has a 720° steering angle, so it needs a higher lock value for the same steering ratio. And my other issue is that I've seen entries like "adjusted baseline steering lock by 1.5 degrees" in the changelog. What the hell does that mean? The setup screen only allows me to use integers, so where has that 1.5 came from?
So after some testing I did my best leaderboard time in the Scirocco at Zandvoort using 11 steering lock. More is good for the first sector but you lose out too much on the rest of the track. Less than 10 is also slower for the same reason. At Macau in the F4 I tried your suggestion in the rcs file but it does not seem to work for keyboard. On the other hand, with max steering lock I put speed sensitive min and max speed to lower values and raised the sensitivity value from 75 to 100 and the car was rock steady in a straight line so those are the parameters to play with track by track and car by car. I would also need to test in race conditions where tyre wear is a factor but it´s good to know those 2 settings are compatible.
I just drove GT4 and GT5 around that track and haven't had any problems fitting the car in corners. The problem was the same as before: the cars are too twitchy, especially in low speed corners when speed-sensitive steering doesn't kick in. In RF2 I drove a GT3 car on that track with lock 9 and it was enough - on the edge, but still enough. I don't know how it works for FWD, but this is what I did in regards to GT3 cars: - Watched a few real life onboard videos from Spa. - Noticed how much drivers turn their wheel: the only places where they steer more than 90 degrees are first corner and last chicane, everywhere else it's between 45 and 90. - Used steering ratios from ACC to estimate how much steering was actually on the front wheels: depending on a car and corner the steering was between 3 and 8 degrees. - Drove a few laps myself (in R3E) to see how much speed-sensitive steering would interfere. If everything works as described, it starts at 130 km/h and maxes out at 240 km/h (be default). In most corners it either doesn't work or only starts applying, making little change. The only two sections where it makes any noticeable change are Eau Rouge/Raidillon and Blanchimont where you don't want full lock anyway. So for now it looks like 8 degrees really is enough (for modern cars on majority of normal tracks). Whether it makes you faster or not, is another question and it depends on other control settings and your driving style.
Too twitchy with damping at 100? If you are using a wheel then just lower standard sensitivity and it should be good. One thing I notice is there is a discrepancy on a car per car basis. The new McLaren for example is really not reactive whereas the BMW Gt4 is on the opposite end of the scale. The only GT3 I am comfortable in is the 720GT3. in RRE try reducing the maximum speed to 130 or a little bit more and see what happens. Also increase the level to 80 or more.
Yes, very twitchy. When you mentioned McLaren I took it to Cadwell Park and it was, uhm, tolerable. Other cars I tried on that track were basically undrivable. It gets better on faster and wider circuits where speed-sensitive steering works and you have a margin for error. Why? I put it to 130/130/85 and the results are as expected, the car becomes much harder to drive once it hits 130 km/h.
For everything that was discussed here I used a keyboard, except for rF2 where I used a wheel. Upd: I finally tried it on a wheel too. It was basically okay, but with reduced lock it would still be better.
I just can´t fathom how any car could be twitchy at any speed with 100 damping, 100 speed sensitivity and 14 lock, it´s not like there is a big difference between keyboards that could account for it either. Can you screenshot your control settings and check you are using default car setups just in case there was something weird happening?
The difference might come from: 1) Cars and tracks. Like I said before, 720s was much better than other cars I tried, and also when I'm driving on fast and wide tracks (like Nurb GP) it's kinda okay. But something like M4 GT4 at Cadwell Park - I'm really struggling to even put in one lap without losing control, going off track or awkwardly driving at 30-50 km/h through a section of turns because that's the only way not to lose the car. 2) Personal preferences. If you're used to driving with higher lock or "tapping" technique, then it might be good for you. I prefer the opposite: slow and fine controls, "press and hold".
Yeah, I'll try it. Anyway, I'm glad I asked my question because I learned a lot thanks to that. Thank you guys!
I think that 2 issues are present with the game, 1) steering sensitivity slider (at any speed) is not working with keys and maybe pads. 2) the cars are inconsistently designed so some have more direct steering than others, even in the same car class.
It works for me. 1) Dialing it down to zero makes cars noticeably more twitchy. If you're in an open wheeler you can even see that your front wheels turn more than if it's on 100. 2) At speed you see that front wheels turn less than when stationary. If you have some open space to skid through (say, Mercedes Arena), you can turn your wheel and hold it, let the car spin, and see how steering angle of the front wheels increases while your speed drops.
Speed sensitivity works. Steering sensitivity, throttle and brake have no effect in AMS2 but do in RRE