FOV (Field of View) if you don't have triples, ONE computer screen is just fine

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Turtle Power, Jan 22, 2019.

  1. ravey1981

    ravey1981 Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    Some rough photos of how mine is set up, ideally I could do with another 2 of those screens but it's not happening! Mrs would kill me... 2nd photo shows my view on game with z4. Note because of photos perspective is a bit weird between wheel and screen but in person it looks totally natural
     

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  2. MattStone

    MattStone Well-Known Member

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    @ravey1981
    That Almost looks like a 1:1
    Is that monitor a tv?
     
  3. ravey1981

    ravey1981 Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    Yeah it's a Samsung 32inch, only 1080p but does have a game mode which brings response time back down to near monitor levels. Again, it's a compromise..... If only I knew how to grow a money tree.....

    Another thing with 1:1, or true FOV, is that even though on a setup like this vision is limited you can still tell exactly where your wheels are relative to kerbs etc as it feels totally natural. You can sit in the seat and point to where the wheel would be, it just works. Same with cars in front, you know exactly how far away they are. With artificially wide FOV a car can look like it's a car length away where actually you're right on its bumpers.
     
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  4. RWB Charger

    RWB Charger Well-Known Member

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    It's driving me mad I tell you! I have been messing since this thread and I physically want to get my triples as close as possible and my chair at centre level but a load of things are scuppering me ;-(

    The Accuforce base itself is about a foot long then add in the QR and button box and I'm probably 16-17inches away, I can't get my screens any closer because of the base and also I have a slight leak in my shed roof lol which means if I get a heavy downpour it will leak on to my centre monitor so they are about 4 inches back from the back of the base so that adds up to around 20 inches then the distance leaning back in my chair adds probably another 24inches so a total of around 44 inches or over a metre, then I can't get my office racing chair low enough because of the new buttkicker stopping the gas lift going down, it's really bugging me now!

    So I now have a list, fix roof, get an adjustable triple monitor stand that I can pull forward and back that will go over my base right up to the back of my rim and then butcher my racing chair to go lower, damn this thread lol.

    I mean I have it pretty much 1:1 in scale with the roundness of the top of the dash and in game rim size in GT3 (i turn it off though) to the size of my physical rim so it looks ok but feels like I have an extension on the steering column, I know some race cars do actually have long columns and the driver sits quite far back but for some cars it just looks wrong, like open wheel feels like I'm sitting too high and too far back, is there an option for seat rake??

    Although to be honest I measured my real car today from my head distance to the top of the dash not the windscreen and I'm pretty much about the same distance, I also kept my head facing forward and moved my eyes left and right and can see my right and left wing mirror which is also how I have my screens set up

    Also this FOV in game we are talking about 0.5-1.0 what does that one actually do as I left it at 1 assuming the other adjustable FOV for triples was the one that I needed but maybe need to adjust that as well
     
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  5. ravey1981

    ravey1981 Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    Getting those screens as close as possible is the most important thing initially (after fixing the roof) as it gives you a relatively bigger hole to look through into the game world. As you mention the office style chair I assume you are using a desk style setup? Obviously this causes issues compared to a cockpit type setup....everything becomes easy when you design it to put things in certain places. The accuforce has a pretty slim base so you could probably sit the monitors on top if you can get/make a stand for them.... You want to be aiming for within 600-800mm from your eyes and the centre of the screen horizontal from your eyeline. Only then can you start working out what FOV value you need....use the calculator linked previously.

    Regarding the FOV value, raceroom uses an odd system, no idea why, its bonkers. All other sims let you plug the angles straight in.... this nicked from RaceDept explains how it works. note this definitely holds true for single screen, I have no idea whether triples are worked out differently...

    *******
    You're probably aware that R3E doesn't offer the usual FOV setting in degrees, but instead opts for setting FOV via a cryptic multiplier number. Thankfully, it has been recently explained on S3 forum in one of the posts what the number actually means:

    It is a multiplier of the default FOV value of 58 degrees (vertical FOV). So for your convenience, here's a conversion table of all possible in-game FOV values.

    1.3x - 75.4 degrees
    1.2x - 69.6 degrees
    1.1x - 63.8 degrees
    1.0x - 58 degrees
    0.9x - 52.2 degrees
    0.8x - 46.4 degrees
    0.7x - 40.6 degrees
    0.6x - 34.8 degrees
    0.5x - 29 degrees

    ********

    Once you have your correct FOV value, don't ever change it unless you move the position of your monitor or seat.

    You can then fiddle with in game seat adjustment to fine tune individual cars to your liking (shouldn't need much if all other steps followed)

    Hope this helps
     
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  6. AlleyViper

    AlleyViper Active Member

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    Because of this, I've made this thread some days ago. Having at least 0.05 steps would help to fine tune FOV on a single screen, currently 5.8ยบ per 0.1 step is a lot.
     
  7. RWB Charger

    RWB Charger Well-Known Member

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    Ah that helps, so at 1x I am not far off the actual I think 50FOV I have on the triples, I may try .8/.9 and see what happens.

    Oh and it's the Accuforce V1 which isn't as small as the V2 but yes I could get a stand or make one that allowed them to sit on top of it but would have to keep the seat higher to get the centre line which at the moment isn't a problem, it is a desk but pretty much laid out cockpit style but I use it for other stuff.

    I could build a rig though and split the PC between triples and a single on the desk for the other stuff, just spent that much on kit the last 12-18months (some of which I haven't told her indoors about yet ;-)) that I think if I spend any more I'm gonna be homeless lol.
     
  8. ravey1981

    ravey1981 Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    Lol well I built my rig in a day when she went out...I secretly acquired all the materials over time whilst brewing up the plan in my head. I had all the sim equipment from before so not much outlay this time around.... I do need a better wheel at some point though..... I have other hobbies which also eat up cash at an alarming rate and I'm on a spending ban for now....

    Anyway.... I assume you've gone through the initial steps in this thread:

    https://forum.sector3studios.com/index.php?threads/how-to-setup-triple-screens.9711/

    If so and assuming all your measurements were correct you can forget the calculator as it should set it all up for you including FOV. It goes without saying though that if you can get the monitors closer it will feel and look better.
     
  9. RWB Charger

    RWB Charger Well-Known Member

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    I did yes but for the bezels portion i used 0 as I set that in NV bezel correction and use the bezel corrected resolution so it's not needed in that command line, I also used my organic measuring device to measure the distance from screen to eye as that is a set length if you catch my drift ;-)
     
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  10. MattStone

    MattStone Well-Known Member

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    Hey is there any way to reset the seat position?
    I'm curious to know the default seating position at the prescribed FOV
     
  11. ravey1981

    ravey1981 Well-Known Member Beta tester

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  12. FlakNine

    FlakNine Member

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    This is hilarious, and feels oh so familiar! :D
     
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  13. GooseCreature

    GooseCreature Well-Known Member

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    Sure you're not Jimmy Broadbent? :D
     
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  14. fufsgfen

    fufsgfen Active Member

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    How far your steering wheels are from your chest?

    From center of wheel to chest I have 10cm, to keep distance of eye to monitor short, but my wheel is about 10cm too high too, I would think 20-25cm from chest to wheel would be better, that would allow strong muscles of arm still do the wheel turning, but it would not get so cramped at chicanes, however that would make monitor to sit already 10-15cm further which is quite bit in percentage and would affect FOV a lot.

    I don't like to go lower than 0.9 FOV as corners appear then truncated to me and it becomes difficult to see depth of corner.

    From bottom of wheel to legs I have 12cm, which I think is bit much, IRL I remember there was not too much space between legs and wheel. With race cars they do take wheel off before getting out too.

    While I'm fine with current setup, I have had some crazy ideas of cutting table, setting wheel somewhat lower and bringing monitor to bit closer and higher, it would be compromise though as now eye is dead center of monitor, bit higher would be worse, but closer might be able to compensate that so total would be better.

    Even with triples, I would set them up closer to be able to keep bit more distance to wheel. Having monitor arm to hold monitor would also be needed as base of monitor just is getting on way.

    Triples is not going to happen though, whatever I do I probably need to be creative with zero budget.

    Cheap trick we used IRL was to put pieces of tape to windscreen, just drove car so that tires were at edge of road and put tape where edge of road appeared to be. None of us cheats such way with our monitors of course :p
     
  15. spyshagg

    spyshagg Active Member

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    That is not entirely correct. I have a 55" 4K tv now, 5cm behind the wheel. What this allowed for, was a massive increase in FOV that you did not contemplate in your reasoning. I am getting visibility from the sides that I could only get when using 27" if I used triplescreens.
     
  16. ravey1981

    ravey1981 Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    Wheel at 10cm from your chest is just crazy, how do you even drive like that?? I'm not at my rig now but I'd estimate around 35cm. I looked at lots of photos of GT and touring car driving positions when designing my rig to get it close to real life as possible. It gives me about a 90 bend at the elbow and is very comfortable. Top of wheel is around 50mm below my eye line. Again this is influenced by real in car positions....
     
  17. ravey1981

    ravey1981 Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    Very similar to this, currently I have my pedals a bit lower but I may move the up...it's still a work in progress...
     

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  18. DreamsKnight

    DreamsKnight Well-Known Member

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    FOV is math. the math is not an opinion.

    the FOV is the value expressed in degrees of an angle. to be precise, it is the angle at the top of the isosceles triangle between the eyes and the edges of the screen.
    this means that the correct fov is one and only one calculated with precise math formulas.
    the angle is easily calculated starting from two values that are the distance between the screen and the eyes (ie the angle bisector) and the width (or height) of the screen ***

    it is obvious that the angle increases in value when you increase the width or decrease the distance, and YES, you see more things on the sides.

    a 50" at 1 meter generates a fov identical to the one of a 25" at 50cm. it is pure math, again.

    who claims that with the same fov (typed in the game) two screens of different sizes placed at the same distance give the same image is right. the problem is that the number typed in the game is wrong. it's obvious, the same fov, the same image. this is why you had to CALCULATE and insert the correct fov to have the right portion of the image.

    (*** online calculator deduce width and height of the screen giving him the ratio of the monitor (16: 9, 16:10 etc) and the value of the diagonal (50 ", 27" etc) again with simple math.)

    in the triple monitor case the math is the same. the only thing to check is if the rendering of the side screens is independent or not. only project cars 1 is not able to do it, and in that case the calculated fov is exactly three times what would be obtained with a single screen.
    it's true also that in the case of separate rendering the games generally ask for the values mentioned above and they have they do the math for you.

    explanation of separate rendering
    https://www.isrtv.com/forums/topic/19244-bad-triple-monitor-support-in-project-cars-explained/

    THE BIBLE ABOUT CORRECT MONITOR POSITION
    https://www.xsimulator.net/community/threads/fov-best-inmersion-in-our-cockpit.5962/


    i hope my post could help someone.

    ps: my view with a 50" correctly placed
     
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  19. fufsgfen

    fufsgfen Active Member

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    I think I had wheel bit closer IRL than that, but yeah, 10cm is bit bad, it works fine with P911 GT3 with quick steering, but need to have bit more if going to steer lot more.

    As my wheel is also bit too high, that might actually allow me to have it closer.

    I would not mind 50" screen though :p

    Distance to monitor just gets bit far if I place myself 35cm from wheel, 25cm would be better, hate limitations.

    I guess I need to build racing cockpit thing at some point.

    Wheels should have monitor mounts integrated :D
     
  20. Turtle Power

    Turtle Power Well-Known Member

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    t
    That looks pretty good to me