Released PORSCHE 934 Turbo RSR (Group 4)

Discussion in 'News & Announcements' started by Georg Ortner, Dec 19, 2018.

  1. neil

    neil Member

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    I don't mind single series like the pro one or cup cars as there is one one irl. Not sure about the DTM mercs are they to add other cars?
     
  2. ravey1981

    ravey1981 Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    Really??? The game just took a huge step forward and you want to moan? 2 brand new classes introduced within a month. Yes there's only the Porsche in G4 at the moment but clearly it will be expanded.

    I only ever see the DTM mercs as a bonus, they were used for the online comps, they could have just not released them into the game at all. They probably don't have licences for the other cars, that may or may not change in the future.

    Group A will undoubtedly receive it's physics update soon, you can't have everything all at once......

    Keep up the great work I say....
     
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  3. Flintenwilly

    Flintenwilly Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, i hate that the TCR and GT4 class only contain one car. Just awful...

    Jokes aside, would love to see that the mercs get some buddies to play with. But if not they are good filler for VLN-grid. Would also love to see that the vln audi gets a playmate. But hey, for now I have Lot to play with

    Merry christmas to all
     
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  4. Anthony Monteil

    Anthony Monteil Sector3 Developer

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    I agree that this is a hell of a headache for the BOP, but there are some options to sort it out, in exemple pick the fastest Div.II cars, like the latest Zakspeed Escort II RS that managed to grab several DRM wins in early 80's. ;)
     
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    Last edited: Dec 20, 2018
  5. Fleskebacon

    Fleskebacon Well-Known Member

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    The 934 drives like a madman. I love it. FFB feels really good, the car sounds and looks lovely.

    Still not impressed with the clutch/engine momentum management, as the engine is really easy to stall, and almost impossible to burnout - even on grass or sand. (Any car will do a burnout on grass.) But these are minor details - everything else is working flawlessly as far as I can see.

    Thanks!
     
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  6. Beastux

    Beastux Active Member

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    I think it's the other way round: the Group 4 changed for the 1976 season (as well as the Group 5) but the BMW M1 was only produced from 1978 to 1981. The Procar series ran for the 1979 and 1980 seasons and the BMW M1 was only homologated as Group 4 racer on december 1st 1980, being entered as Group 4 at the 1981 Le Mans 24H (#71 & #72).

    I never heard about Escorts racing in Group 4 as this group was created for Grand Touring cars. Zakspeed entered Escorts in DRM and ETC in Group 2 and Group 5 (DRM Div.2).

    The cars entered in road races shared the groups names with the rally cars but were rarely the same cars. You could find Escorts in Group 1, Group 2 and Group 4 in rallies but no Group 4 Escort in road racing (same for Opel Kadett for example). The main exception was maybe the Porsche 911 which could run in Group 3 or Group 4 in rallies and road races.
     
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  7. Beastux

    Beastux Active Member

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    Are you sure of that?
     
  8. RoccoTTS

    RoccoTTS Well-Known Member

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    I compared the Porsche 934 and BMW M1 procar times at Zolder because they are both Group 4.
    BMW M1 Procar 1:35.6 and Porsche 934 1:42.6 (my own times).
     
  9. RampageRacing

    RampageRacing Member

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    As an American and a fan of Brumos Racing, Peter Gregg and Hurley Heywood, I am glad to see the Porsche and their livery in the game. I wish that the car was sporting the #59 that was so iconic throughout the years that it raced in IMSA in NA. I now live within 50 miles of Jacksonville Florida but sadly Brumos is no more.
     
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  10. m.bohlken

    m.bohlken Well-Known Member

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    Maybe a bit difficult to compare them at the moment. If I remember right, the Procar is not on the same physics-level as the Porsche 934 - or was it updated recently? maybe @Alex Hodgkinson can give some insights on that...
     
  11. ravey1981

    ravey1981 Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    Tyres could also be different. The 934 is on cross-plys, if the procar is on a more modern construction it would explain the difference in lap-time. There will have to be BOP used to equalise the class anyway even if in real life there wasn't.
     
  12. keanos

    keanos Well-Known Member

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    Wikipedia (https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_M1#Motorsport) says:

    Ursprünglich war der BMW M1 für den Einsatz im Motorsport geplant, nur eine Homologationsserie sollte in kleiner Auflage für den öffentlichen Straßenverkehr gebaut werden. Durch Änderungen im internationalen Reglement noch vor der Präsentation des BMW M1 erwies er sich als Rennfahrzeug jedoch praktisch als überflüssig. Er wurde mit mäßigem Erfolg zwar noch als Rennwagen in diversen Serien eingesetzt, die Mehrzahl der produzierten Fahrzeuge wurde aber entgegen der ursprünglichen Planung als Straßenversion an Privatleute verkauft.

    Lediglich in der Procar-Serie, einem Rahmenprogramm der Formel 1 in den Jahren 1979 und 1980, erlangte der BMW M1 größere Aufmerksamkeit im Bereich des Rennsports. In der Procar-Serie traten die fünf schnellsten Formel-1-Fahrer aus den Trainingsläufen mit Werksfahrzeugen des BMW M1 gegen ausgewählte private Fahrer dieses Fahrzeugtyps an.

    Translation:
    "Originally, the BMW M1 was planned for use in motorsport, only a homologation series should be built in small numbers for public roads. Due to changes in the international regulations even before the presentation of the BMW M1, however, it proved practically superfluous as a race car. Although it was used with modest success as a racing car in various series, but the majority of the produced vehicles was sold, contrary to the original plan as a street version to private individuals.

    Only in the Procar series, a framework program of Formula 1 in the years 1979 and 1980, the BMW M1 gained more attention in the field of racing. In the Procar series, the five fastest Formula 1 drivers from the training runs with factory vehicles of the BMW M1 competed against selected private drivers of this type of vehicle."

    Afaik BMW tried to bring some M1 to the Gr.5 regulation with a workskit, the same as Porshe did with the Porsche 934/5, but the cars were either forbidden or only used very rarely because there were already more succesful or more modern cars with better performance than the upgraded cars.
     
  13. Alex Hodgkinson

    Alex Hodgkinson Sector3 Developer

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    They're at different physics stages, yes. However, a Procar M1 is different to a Group 4 M1 in a few ways..
    • Tyres used in endurance races are much harder
    • The Procar rev limit was ~9300, but endurance racing meant the engines were only usually revved to <8900
    • Minimum weight was higher, plus endurance spec parts - fuel tanks - brakes - drive shafts etc, seems to add around 100kg
    Also maybe the current Procar is a little bit too quick in game. Although Zolder is different now, the fastest lap was 1:39.14 in 1979.
     
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  14. Rac0R84

    Rac0R84 Active Member

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    the 934 is a great car, but ive a problem the car is for example at zolder at some section really nervous and have a tendence to go sideways
     
  15. Alex Hodgkinson

    Alex Hodgkinson Sector3 Developer

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    Try stiffer springs front & rear
     
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  16. RoccoTTS

    RoccoTTS Well-Known Member

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    Yes, Zolder has changed a lot after the Gilles Villeneuve crash in 1982. It was much faster in 1979.
     
  17. David Peres

    David Peres Well-Known Member

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    I praised the 934 in the update thread, but after taking him for a few laps of the Norschleife today I just feel like I have to praise it again. This car is AMAZING and it's now probably my favourite car to hotlap the Nords in Raceroom. Funny that I was hoping so hard for the 962 (still am) but now I think I'm actually happier that we got this first.

    When it comes to actual racing I usually prefer modern machinery like the GT3 or WTCR since modern GT/Touring cars provide closer racing and more action, but if we talk about hotlaping, then I prefer cars that I have to fight and sweat my way to a decent lap time, and until now that was an area where Raceroom was lacking a bit for me since the most likely candidates for the type of car that I like to hotlap are still running the old "planted" physics (Touring Classics).

    @Alex Hodgkinson, please don't ever "tame" this car, no matter how many might complain that it's too dificult. It's not, it's perfect :)

    Also, I think this is now one of, if not the best showcase for the physics engine in Raceroom.
     
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  18. RoccoTTS

    RoccoTTS Well-Known Member

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    I like to highlight this !!
     
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  19. Beastux

    Beastux Active Member

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    A BMW M1 in Gr.5 configuration won the 1981 Nürburgring 1000 km race driven by Hans-Joachim Stuck and Nelson Piquet. Even if the race was shortened after Herbert Muller's fatal accident, this car was fast (5th on the grid) and could be a winner driven by top class champions on such a track.

    Before that, the same Hans-Joachim Stuck was short of taking the lead of the 1980 Le Mans 24H and stood in 2nd position for 3 hours under heavy rain (with an IMSA M1 not far from a Procar model) so I think that Wikipedia does not really make justice to the racing capacities of this car.
     
  20. Fleskebacon

    Fleskebacon Well-Known Member

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    I have an apology to announce: This does NOT apply to the new 934. For once, I was a bit trigger happy when I posted. After a little more testing, everything turns out to be perfect with this car (wheel spin in sand pits and on grass and everything). Sorry @Alex Hodgkinson and everyone else on the team. :oops:

    Really looking forward to the other H-pattern cars getting the same treatment! :D
     
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