Suggested car and track for newbie

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Aleksey Gershin, Aug 22, 2019.

  1. Aleksey Gershin

    Aleksey Gershin New Member

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    Hello,

    Can anyone suggest me a car/track combo to learn the very basics of sim racing? I have Thrustmaster TX wheel and TH8A Pro pedals, but no shifter...

    Thank You!
     
  2. ravey1981

    ravey1981 Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    The formula junior is a great car to learn in. It's easy to drive but harder to master, it won't let you get away with sloppy braking. Be as smooth as you can with your inputs (steering and pedals). It's also free....

    Brands Indy is a good track to learn on, it's short enough that there's not much to remember but every corner is different and challenging in different ways.
     
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  3. Sosruko

    Sosruko Member

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    I second FRJ except it has H-pattern gearbox so you can't actually drive it properly without a shifter.
     
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  4. Olaf Hülse

    Olaf Hülse Well-Known Member

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    I would also recommend FrJr as it's fairly cheap to buy as well as Brands Hatch. Other circuits that offer various corner types are eg.: Paul Ricard, Raceroom Raceway, Stowe and Portimao. If you want to drive Touring Cars or GT's in the future try out the Silhouette Concepts (with/without TC and ABS) or the GT4's. Fairly easy cars which let you learn smooth lines and keeping momentum through the corners are the NSU TTS Cup and the BMW M235i.

    Greetings
     
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  5. Olaf Hülse

    Olaf Hülse Well-Known Member

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    Well, for beginners this offers enough of a challenge even without shifter. It is easier to drive with shifting pedals in the first races and doesn't affect the overall car behaviour that much.
     
  6. Winzarten

    Winzarten Well-Known Member

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    Depends on what kind of race cars you feel would you enjoy to race.
    If you would like to race open wheelers, then the formula JR is really a best place to start.

    For touring cars, the free silhouette cars are actually pretty good. They are like DTM junior, stiff, stable, and glued to the tarmac. But they are not insanely powerfull, so corners come and go at managable pace.

    As you're new to simracing then something low powered, like the BMW M235I, might be a good choice. It is a great car for teaching the basics of keeping momentum, and taking the correct racing line.

    One thing to keep in mind, is that you just need one livery, to be able to race the class. All cars are unlocked for AI from the start. Also you can test all cars before you buy them.

    For tracks, I think something on the shorter side (slower cars). Hockenhein, Red bull Ring, Autodrome Most, Mid Ohio..

    And experiment, we all have different tastes, and like different tracks/cars.. you need to find yours :)
     
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  7. Aleksey Gershin

    Aleksey Gershin New Member

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    Thanks a lot guys! Is there anything similar to FJR, but with a modern transmission? Trying to shift gears with paddles while having to use clutch and heel/toe-ing just throws me off.

    I've tried Raceroom circuit and it's a great track, but is it really good to try to perfect basics on? I can't help but think that a more flat ring would be a better choice?

    P.S. I was fortunate enough to do a few autocrosses and some laps on a circuit in real life, but I have a hard time relating what I felt to how cars handle in sims. How do I know when my wheels start to lock up? Not sure if my FFB settings are just not working, but it seems like the only que is the screeching wheel sound and by that time it's too late too fix things up. I've tried to test drive 911 Cup on Raceway Circuit, but was all over the place and managed just a couple of clean turns after around 30min of driving. I know I'm overdriving the car, but I was looking for braking feedback and just couldn't find any.

    Thanks!
     
  8. Nico Kunze

    Nico Kunze Well-Known Member

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    You can just select "manual + autoclutch" and youll be able to shift without having to use the clutch

    Regarding the cup porsche its one of the hardest cars to drive in the game (for me anyways :D) so i wouldnt worry about it too much for now although later on it could be a good car to further improve your driving
     
  9. Winzarten

    Winzarten Well-Known Member

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    The 911 Cup Car is one of the harder cars to drive, becuase of its heavy tendency to oversteer when unsettled under braking (heavy back, simpler suspension, no electronic assitance). Driving that car in a heavily undulated track (like the free raceroom track) can be real challange. It is a hard car to build the muscle memory on.

    It is something you just need to develop the muscle memory and feel for. Brakes locking isn't something that can be translated to FFB very well.
     
  10. ravey1981

    ravey1981 Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    Yep, just use manual autoclutch if you have no H shifter.....

    Locking the wheels you will hear the tyres, it's a slightly different sound to tyre scrub, you can't really miss it. Note that with ABS on it is practically impossible to lock up even when doing stupid stuff....
     
  11. Olaf Hülse

    Olaf Hülse Well-Known Member

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    Well, Raceroom Raceway has no gravel traps and some interesting corners that are especially tricky with the elevation changes. (Like the Blind Off-Camber Turns and the one that keeps kicking your rear around) In my opinion, this is a fairly short track with few straights and corners that you'll find on many different tracks like Spa or Nordschleife. But this one is more compact. This means you can practice one specific combination more frequent. Also recommend Tracks like Stowe, Mantorp Park or, most important, the Swedish Nordschleife Knutstorp Ring (even though I just can't get S2+S3 right ;) ).Slow tracks with corner combinations just a few meters away.
    Greetings
     
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  12. Zziggy

    Zziggy Member

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    Contrary to common belief I think it is best to start with the fastest car you can handle. Like DTM or the P2 Chevrolet. Because: skills like quick decisions and reflexes carry over well from faster to slower cars but not vice versa. And for a track: try to drive on one track only. Off course it must then be one you have fun with. First it allows you to develop skills by multiple repetitions. Secondly it will be easier to judge different setup options and different car behaviours.
     
  13. Nico Kunze

    Nico Kunze Well-Known Member

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    Definitely will disagree on that. You can abuse the frx17 in all kinds of ways and if you try to drive the frj after that youll be spinning all over the place :D
    Not to say i started with something very slow (probably started with gt3s) but i think in general it makes sense to do so
    Wouldnt even bother with that until im comfortable driving the cars on the limit, certainly not as someone whos just beginning
    But at the end it might come down to everybodys gotta find out what works best for them :D
     
  14. MattYKee

    MattYKee Member

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    I like Suzuka West layout for a short fun track that has corners you can attack aswell as lean on. Raceroom raceway is a favourite of mine too but the ai along with the short straights make it hard to race on.
    The free tracks of Portamao, Sepang and Raceroom raceway in that order are a great collection to start on for training. If you have trouble with any of them just go to Stowe to get the basics down.
    That depends.. If you trained yourself to handle the Frx17 with the lowest downforce setup i think you'll be alright.
     
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  15. Winzarten

    Winzarten Well-Known Member

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    But at start you shouldn't be focusing on being able to handle high powered cars. At the start you should really be focusing on the basics (if you really want to learn proper), like what is the correct line through a corner, how to carry the most momentum. And high powered cars are much more forgiving in this regard, because they can get up to speed quickly.
    It takes much more time for a low powered car to get up to speed agian, making mistakes more costly. But also good lines more obvious, because of gained time. This way you will learn which lines to take, and you can then apply this knowledge when learning faster cars where things happen much faster.

    Walk, before you try to run.
     
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  16. Sosruko

    Sosruko Member

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    Did you take this advice? I think it is a wonderful choice if you are aiming for faster GT cars later on.
     
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  17. Aleksey Gershin

    Aleksey Gershin New Member

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    I've been practicing in FRJ on RaceRoom Raceway and tried Stowe for a few laps as well. I did not buy any extra content yet.
     
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  18. Aleksey Gershin

    Aleksey Gershin New Member

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    So I gave M235i a test drive, granted you get to test cars on the same Raceroom Raceway. This car felt glued to the road, such a huge difference compared to FRJ. How is physics on this car, has it been updated?

    P.S. I've also tried BMW M3 Sport Evolution and expected car to be tail happy, but much to my surprise it was almost just as stable as M235i. Not even sure what to take from that...
     
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  19. Olaf Hülse

    Olaf Hülse Well-Known Member

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    The M235i is pretty glued thanks to the tyres and Electronics (TC, ABS). But that means: If you go over the level of grip in corners, TC and others start to work and therefore slow the car down heavily. You can loose a lot of time in the corners if you choose the wrong line or try too hard.
    The FrJr is a open wheeler without Aero parts, ABS and TC. Additionaly, the tyres are quite small and far away from the car centre, but front and rear is very close. This causes spins, lock ups and bad grip. It's a challenge to handle it smoothly
    The M3 is a legend thanks to good handling and power transmission through the drivetrain and low weight. It is really controlable even during sideway moments. But it had no ABS or TC (in most of the Touring Versions). This means that you go sideways and therefore loose time. Old Touring Cars were wrecked cars from accidents on the streets. They were empty inside, only the Roll Bar/Cage was inside it. Some even had no side windows... With time and popularity comes money. The Cars were improved quite rapidly back then. So much that in the Mid 90's, the Class 1 Reglement Cars had almost nothing to do with the road versions apart from the look (That's why we call these and the new DTM's 'Silhouette Cars'). In the last season of ITC in 1996 (and only the second ever as the costs per car and weekend exploded), everyone said that they were more futuristic, modern and advanced than F1 back in these days. So the M3 marked a 'halfway point': From wreckage to Top Engineering. If you'd like to, try out the 1995 Mercedes DTM and the BMW 635 CSi and feel the difference :)
    Greetings
     
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  20. ravey1981

    ravey1981 Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    Don't use the M3 as your benchmark, it's on the oldest physics version and is due to be updated soon. It overly easy to drive at the moment.

    FRJ is on latest physics and m235 is on newish physics. If you prefer to drive the m235 it makes a good learner car.