Question Teach me Ranking

Discussion in 'Community Support' started by Nash Bobo, Apr 7, 2021.

  1. Nash Bobo

    Nash Bobo Member

    Joined:
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    +12 / 0 / -0
    I am trying to learn the ranking system. Why am I falling in the ranking system, when I gained 3 positions in a race with no indents and fell in ratings (1427.896 to 1406.061). Look at the top column 7/4/2021 15:44.25. New to ranking, what do I have to do? Want to understand.

    20210407164558_3.jpg


    Thanks
    "Nash"
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2021
  2. Nico Kunze

    Nico Kunze Well-Known Member

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    Incidents only affect your reputation and not your ranking. Whether you lose or gain positions during the race doesnt matter either. The only thing that matters is what position you finish in and how high your ranking was compared to your opponents entering the race. Then a presumably complicated and unknown formula is applied and thatll determine your ranking gain/loss.
    (One thing im wondering tho is how you finished 3rd in a race with only 2 drivers :D)
     
  3. Nash Bobo

    Nash Bobo Member

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    Nico, I can't answer about that first race at 16:25:31 on the 6th of April. My computer screen cuts off on the right side and doesn't let me see it all. Maybe someone else can see more what went on in that race.

    Thanks for the clarification in ranking. What I can see so far on lap times is that mostly aliens in the rookie races.

    "Nash"
     
  4. J.Simonds

    J.Simonds Member

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    It's OK Nash.. it isn't you.. the aliens troll the rookie races to make sure everyone knows they are the "cock of the walks" around here... rookie races aren't named rookies for you, they are the sign for the feeding ground buffet... they also enjoy ramming and other sporty activities... Enjoy your racing experience!
     
  5. Nash Bobo

    Nash Bobo Member

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    J. thanks for the pep talk. But lay down 1:16's at bridge in a Lotus GT4. I know people can't for get its a game. But it's makes you believe you belong in the sub sub rookie class. At this rate my rating will be in the sub 1,000's by tomorrow.

    Hanging in there J.

    "Nash"
     
  6. 16sth

    16sth New Member

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    When looking using a browser press the control key and press the minus key to zoom out. The stats on the far right hand side will show. Keep zooming out until you see them all. Control key and + to zoom back in. (Page layout isn't the best.)
     
  7. Nico Kunze

    Nico Kunze Well-Known Member

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    Just out of curiosity it hasnt perhaps crossed your mind that the rookie servers simply can be more appealing regarding better car/track combos, fixed setups and being able to almost instantly find a race to join.
    And the term rookie server doesnt imply that its main target group is unexperienced or slow drivers but rather players who havent done any ranked racing yet and cant enter non rookie servers due to reputation restrictions. But with that in mind a) everybody has to do a couple races on the rookie servers at least once even if speed wise some people might consider you an alien and b) that nash himself should already be sticking to the non rookie servers if one wants to keep the rookie servers reserved for those who need to gain reputation.
    Also its not like higher ranked players will take anything away from the target group as from what ive seen there are enough spots on the servers and a significantly lower ranked player wont lose any rating by losing to a higher ranked player. The only difference it makes is you might be fighting for a little lower positions
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  8. geoffers

    geoffers Active Member

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    Can I add that beating an alien (highly ranked driver) can significantly increase your rating, whereas beating a field full of lesser ranked drivers will do very little to it. So finishing 10th in a field packed with aliens is probably more beneficial to your rating than winning against a field of low ranked drivers.
     
  9. Christian G

    Christian G Topological Agitator Beta tester

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    +2,347 / 0 / -0
    @Nash Bobo
    Rating and reputation work completely independently.
    The reputation score represents your behaviour and safety while on track. Driving cleanly (i.e. not picking up incident points) improves this. Gathering incident points has a negative impact because your incident points are weighed against your clean turns.

    Ranking on the other hand compares your current level with the level of everyone you're competing against in that race and then calculates an estimate of where you should finish based on those relative scores. It is similar to the Elo rating in chess. So in those races you have on record you were beaten by drivers who were rated lower than you were before the race and therefor you lost rating, because the ranking system expected you to finish ahead of those who were rated lower than you.

    Maybe you were just unlucky and ran up against people with a lower rank, so the system expected you to achieve a podium in those races. You shouldn't let this discourage you, there will be race in which you gain rating. :)
    If that's an option, maybe try doing ranked races at a different time of day, just to get a different crowd.

    Regarding your very first race (the one in which you finished 3rd out of 2) there was a third driver but he didn't actually start the race (DNS). You can see this if you click each race in the portal.
    upload_2021-4-8_12-2-44.png
    Here you can also click each of your opponents and see their ranked history, so you can check who you should have beaten and so on.

    Regarding that result I do believe this is some kind of error, a DNS'ed player shouldn't result in you finishing behind him, so thanks for bringing this our attention. We'll investigate and fix this asap.

    Hope this cleared things up a bit, keep racing. :)

    Christian
     
  10. Maskerader

    Maskerader Well-Known Member

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    Also this driver shouldn't be DNS when he did at least two laps (he has consistency score). That's a second time I see a driver being DNS when they actually took part in the race. I think that's the bug that caused these wrong results.
     
  11. Nash Bobo

    Nash Bobo Member

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    I have run about twenty some races since the 4th. If I feel that when I get in a race with to many cars I go hide in the pits until the race is over. I am afraid I am going to hurt my reputation. I really guard my reputation. I lost about 25 points in just a couple of races Thursday afternoon. You can see my record on Thursday the 8th. I would not do this if I was racing in non ranked races. I do wonder if I am being too protective. I don't have much time in the tracks in the starter pack. I pick races with just a couple cars late at night (I live on the east coast of the states).

    I was joining a rookie server in the picture Wednesday night, and it ask me to buy a group 2 car. I thought the starter pack has everything all rookies needs. Can anyone explain all rookie servers in the pix? Can drivers in the states drive on any of the rookie servers with out buying more cars and tracks?

    ScreenshotZZ.png

    Thanks for helping me out.

    "Nash"
     
  12. Arthur Spooner

    Arthur Spooner Well-Known Member

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    Exactly. See what @Christian G wrote:
    If you don't even start you get incident points for a DNS or a DNF but you didn't even do a single corner. Because of that the penalty is quite high. Collecting a few incidents during a whole race is by far not as bad as not race at all. Don't be too afraid of the others. Just drive. And if you feel uncomfortable with a faster guy behind you - maybe because you don't trust him to race cleanly - then just open up the race line and let him pass. Otherwise just race - that's why you entered the race in the first place, right? ;)
     
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  13. Christian G

    Christian G Topological Agitator Beta tester

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    I'd say you are focussing too much on protecting your reputation score.

    Reputation is intended to reflect a drivers safety and reliability around the track. If you total your car on the first lap of a race or, as Christian said, don't collect "clean points" by not driving at all your reputation score is supposed to decrease.

    Regarding disconnecting: There is a penalty for disconnecting and it doesn't take into account why one disconnects. If there was a type of disconnect that didn't get penalised, people would find that out and (ab)use it to rage-quit, which we want to discourage. Hence every disconnect is treated the same way. However, the penalty for disconnecting is not very great. It really only becomes an issue if you disconnect early on in the race. Once you've got a couple clean laps stashed, the impact of the penalty for disconnecting on your reputation is effectively negligible.

    So even if you spin out early on, you should finish the race. Apart from that you really shouldn't care too much about your reputation score. The thing to focus on is doing clean laps and not gathering too many incident points. If you do that, you should have no problem achieving and maintaining a reputation of >80. And as long as you've got that it doesn't really matter whether your rep is 85 or 99, you will be able to join any server you wish to enter.

    Regarding losing many points in one race: Drivers who just started their ranked career are on a quick adjustment regime for the first handful of races in order to allow the system to get to "know you" quicker. After having done some races this fast track will be disabled automatically and your potential losses (and gains) will be smaller.
     
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    Last edited: Apr 9, 2021 at 10:16 AM
  14. Christian G

    Christian G Topological Agitator Beta tester

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    The general rule is that rookie servers feature content that is either free or included in the starter pack. This server you saw was simply an exception from that general rule, but there will always be at least one server that follows this general guideline.
     
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  15. Nash Bobo

    Nash Bobo Member

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    Can any of the officials look at a replay of mind? Started the race, circled the track twice and parked in the pits for the rest of the race because it wasn't going my way. Stayed in the game until it was over. Didn't go off track, didn't touch anything etc. I looked at the reply, nothing I could see. Couldn't be staying in the pits to long, did plenty of that Thursday. The game charged me 4 incident points. The question is, why?

    Laguna Seca Friday 4-9-2021 10:24:22am

    Still trying to learn the ranking system, incident points etc.

    "Nash"
     
  16. Christian G

    Christian G Topological Agitator Beta tester

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    If you hover your cursor over the number of incidents in the race details there will be a pop-up listing the incidents you had in that race and how often you had each.

    In the race you mentioned you had a "going the wrong way" incident, which is worth 4 points:
    upload_2021-4-9_17-17-29.png
    Did you possibly drive in the wrong direction at any point, maybe after some kind of spin or off-track?
    You only get a few metres of grace distance when going the wrong way (think it's sth like 15-20 metres), after that the wrong way incident gets triggered.
     
  17. Nico Kunze

    Nico Kunze Well-Known Member

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    Slightly off topic but ive never been able to do that (neither in game nor in a browser). Could that also be related to monitor width type of stuff like the consistency tab or is there likely something else not working for me?
     
  18. Maskerader

    Maskerader Well-Known Member

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    Yes. You need at least FullHD width (1920 px) to see all the info, but this issue is being looked into, if I recall correctly. A workaround is decreasing your webpage scale when you use your regular browser. Hotkeys are usually Ctrl+"Plus", Ctrl+"Minus" or Ctrl+"mouse wheel up/down".
     
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    Last edited: Apr 9, 2021 at 11:35 PM
  19. blgk

    blgk New Member

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    In the starting grid I hit ESC and I come back to pits with the idea of starting from the pit. But I didn't have the Race option in the menu after that. I stayed in the menu during all the race to avoid disconnection penalty.. but the race ended and I got about -8 Rep
     
  20. Nash Bobo

    Nash Bobo Member

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    Christian, I can't recall saying I was going the wrong way at Laguna Seca Friday morning. Circled
    the track twice after the start, then parked in the pits. The replay shows the car rolling backwards in the pits when I put it in neutral. Turned around to watch TV while the race played out. I have done this a number of races Thursday with no penalty. This is the first time I have had this happen. I never exit the race before checker flag.

    I got that little black box to work in the ranking spreadsheet. Go to the graphs on the right side of the page. click on one of the graphs. Then hover. Goes to show you people are laying a wake at night thinking about making the game better.

    Jim Valvano: “Don't give up . . . don't ever give up.”

    Thanks

    "Nash"