This is why the kick or ban is necessary

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Lachaussette, May 21, 2018.

  1. RWB Rodders

    RWB Rodders Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2018
    Ratings:
    +13 / 0
    lol thanks mate. Sorry for the delay responding but a club mate has ;)

    I sincerely hope we can now live up to expectations set lol.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. XXVI Sol

    XXVI Sol Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2015
    Ratings:
    +94 / 0
    whenever a thread like this comes up,the 'join a club' arguement follows like a shadow. I believe its void cause when sth does not work the best it can,it should be delt with and not look the other way.Speaking for myself,I want to enter a race whenever I feel like it and don't have to always check the mirrors for incoming.
    When I saw about the competition rating system,the first idea or rather hope,was that sth will be done for the multiplayer also,anyone has info about this?Imo a mp rating system would be better than banning people.Put racers with relatively common skill in the same division,but not too many divisions in order to avoid fragmentation.Even have a server for rammers let them knock their selves out
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2019
  3. keanos

    keanos Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2015
    Ratings:
    +60 / 0
    Yes that should be one of the possibilities, but every server owner should be able to ban toxic gamers from their server.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  4. fufsgfen

    fufsgfen Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2019
    Ratings:
    +27 / 0
    Rammers have been a plague at online racing pretty much as long as online racing has existed.

    However I think that there could be ways to make issue less of a problem with programming.

    Say if we have cars at corner, check their speed, if there is a vehicle at much higher velocity near cars at corner area, then have high velocity vehicle pit box automatically by game.

    It would not work for mild cases, but those that crash to others purposely would be dealt with such I believe.

    Accidents per completed valid laps ratio would also be good bar to set for servers, that might make people slow down and be bit more careful.

    There are lot of ways to improve quality of pick up racing, imo.
     
  5. Not Lifting Off

    Not Lifting Off Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2015
    Ratings:
    +340 / 0
    Wouldnt work, what if i miss my breaking point due to cars around me or lack of concentration, or last night first time ive tried to race proper in a couple of months my toes cramped up and i couldnt brake properly at all, had to take evasive action and ended up in the wall, the game boots me to the pits?
    Kick\ban or vote system is the only real logical way, the game doesnt have the thinking skills to be able to differentiate between a deliberate act or total accident, kick\ban and vote can all be abused but if applied fairly work really well.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. fufsgfen

    fufsgfen Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2019
    Ratings:
    +27 / 0
    Technically you are in such situations a rammer, which for others is not much different to one that rams on purpose, it spoils the fun.

    I think it would be better to spoil fun from one that would enter into turn without braking than from potentially several others.

    It is about how you balance such feature, speed different should be great enough to separate those not braking or totally missing braking point from those more of normal situations.

    Well, at least for me, it is no different if someone rear ends my car on purpose, or by hardware / health condition / unskilled reasons, it spoils the fun and such rammer (no matter on purpose or not) is out of race anyway.
     
  7. [RWB] FxUK

    [RWB] FxUK Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2018
    Ratings:
    +72 / 0
    I think he meant that he wouldn't actually be hitting another player, but went into the corner too hot and evaded.

    In which case, going by what you posted:
    emphasis added by me.

    Overshooting would put you in the pits, even without contact. Hence, it wouldn't work and would cause more frustration. To have an automated system that works, it would need a lot of man hours invested in it and lots of potential bugs. You can't beat the human element, imo.

    Accidents happen and it would be wrong to "auto-pit" or kick for such, but persistent trouble makers, well, that's a different story.

    Edit, also, the "rammer" would simply adopt a new tactic. Brake hard in front of other players, perhaps in fast corners, and cause them to be "auto-pitted"
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2019
  8. Not Lifting Off

    Not Lifting Off Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2015
    Ratings:
    +340 / 0
    Agreed, but if i take avoiding action the game still dosnt know how to differentiate, typically i only drive on a few tracks online and would like to think that people that see me often enough would know full well it wasnt a deliberate act, the human element, common sense thinking, oh i just got wiped out by X, accidents happen, even full speed rear ends in real life, its a given, sometimes you just have to suck it up and take it for what it is, it may well be for every action there is a consequence, but not every action needs automatic heavy handed punishment as a consequence!

    There is a definite need for server control, but it needs to be real, logical and fair. A kick, a temp ban, the ability to stop someone joining a server for a set length of time and a permanent ban for repeat offenders, three simple but very effective ways to deal with the real problem drivers.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. RWB 3vil

    RWB 3vil Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2018
    Ratings:
    +22 / 0
    The only "auto " solution that works because it was set out that way, and the user agreed to the user licence when they signed up for it, and that its tied to a minimum requirement to drive particular cars is iRacing safety and driver system.

    It certainly doesn't stop idiots but people have to get to a minimum rating just to be able to race in certain cars and they dont want to lose access to it. And there are persons involved in the record an incident and report system after the fact (otherwise it wouldn't work and people would troll others) and no one is going to re work such a system into their game, nor could they as suddenly denying access to paid for content is illegal.

    A few guys during the first pCars created "Hamster Stew" admin system which worked pretty well for the most part. As always it catches out people at the start of its use on a server and regular players to the server settle in and they get better driver points so that incidents dont auto kick them eg when your a newbie rank an incident would cost you 3000 points which was the auto kick level after some racing your rank improved and incidents cost you less. Even club members were getting caught out at the beginning sometimes through no fault of their own and trolls once more servers adopted HS they knew they could cause major first corner player auto boots and they did just that. It eventually slows up and things work as intended but auto kick systems are open to abuse.

    Its always better to have a server api that clubs can use to see player (steam IDs) and have the ability to MUTE/?KICK/BAN (minutes)/BAN (perm) that way someone in a club can alt tab iun the pits whilst doing some qualy monitoring and remove douchebags early, or if they have to alt tab after a corner 1 bell piece crashes people during a race. Less hassle for everyone, nobody needs to teeter round in fear of an auto ban for having a wobble and a ding.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  10. fufsgfen

    fufsgfen Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2019
    Ratings:
    +27 / 0
    I think that iRacing system as general can make people more careful and improves racing quality as it is clear for everyone how hotlapping pace just does not work out in race, accidents get costly.

    What amazes me is that even online racing has been around for quite long time, more intelligent solutions are not developed, sure ban kick would help, but considering we have today quite impressive amount of computing power as well as software development has evolved quite a bit, there still is no better solutions.

    Surely if effort would be put, much better automated solutions could be created, but perhaps issue is still too minor to be dealt with such effort.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. RWB 3vil

    RWB 3vil Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2018
    Ratings:
    +22 / 0
    It all boils down to costs. Such systems are not cheap to make and such systems need to have the entire game built around it. After the fact just wouldn't work and nobody in the business of game development will put their game updates on pause just to add such a deep system.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  12. XXVI Sol

    XXVI Sol Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2015
    Ratings:
    +94 / 0
    how about having the ability to vote down a player at the end of a race?every player could vote down another only once so if one votes down all the players he sees, does not really make a difference, but if many players vote for one then there would be consequences like no permission to enter competitions or sth.Or have an option in mp lobbies to filter out players with more than 20 vote downs for example.Or when one gets 30 vote downs,theres a marshall(why not a beta tester) that can access the replays of the races that caused the vote downs,watch some of them and decide whether to apply a punishment like a temp ban.Just thinking out loud here
     
    • Creative Creative x 1
  13. RWB 3vil

    RWB 3vil Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2018
    Ratings:
    +22 / 0
    I think it would still be far simpler for Sec3 to re add admin controls to server api than to devise systems into the game code. Simbin of old had it, rFactor games, Automobilista all have it all are Gmotor/ISImotor games.
     
  14. fufsgfen

    fufsgfen Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2019
    Ratings:
    +27 / 0
    I think LFS had something like that?
     
  15. KOKORO ga PYONPYON

    KOKORO ga PYONPYON Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2015
    Ratings:
    +157 / 0
    confession....
    Apologies for all R3E players
    sorry...I acted contrary to sportsmanship today.
    The place is Bathurst's straight.
    It is the same as the mistake made by Romano Fenati.
    opponent was very disappointed,maybe he thought of myself as Madman or noob.
    In reality race, it is license deprivation.
    If it is RaceSim, it may become an account BAN.
    Really just regret.