UPDATE after UPDATE after UPDATE, but...

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by kris_peeters, Oct 22, 2015.

  1. kris_peeters

    kris_peeters Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2015
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    +19 / 0 / -0
    NO PROGRESS!!

    I strongly feel that this game is stuck in a perpetual state of "alfa stage"! There is just no progress
    happening with this game. Don't get me wrong, I like this game, it has tons of potential to become the
    best racing simulator there is, the way the game looks is beautiful, the physics model is amazing, the way
    it sounds is just breathtakingly awesome, the content more than sufficient, but herein lies the problem...
    Update after update after update we get more and more content and more fine tuning of the things that are
    already there, but there is just no progress in really updating the game with the things it painfully lacks
    to become this "best racing simulator" there is. Necessary things like:
    - the option to save your different car setups.
    - the option to choose your tire pressure, your fuel amount, caster settings.
    - a proper collision and mechanical damage model ( no more bumping into walls and into each other at
    100km/h+ without any consequences.
    - AI that overtake each other (this is a racing simulator, not a traffic simulator) and make the occasional
    mistake. ( I know the AI is reasonably good, but they just don't overtake anymore. Just watch a replay
    of a race or a qualifying session and see how a quick opponent stays stuck behind a slow opponent for the
    whole race, session )
    - Working flag rules (blue flag, yellow flag, ...).
    - Manual pit stops.
    - the option to have forced pit stops , tire changes and driver changes in custom championships.
    - the option to have the AI take over the second (or first) stint of a race with forced driver change (be a
    spectator and see how your AI co-pilot handles himself in the race).
    - option for in and out laps during a race
    - ...
    - ...

    I hope S3S really starts focusing on addressing these topics so we can finally enjoy a complete and awesome game in the near future, and in the process see the steam chart numbers for this game rise and rise. A thing that for the moment, even with all the new content coming out, is not the case (the numbers don't even spike for more then 2 or 3 days really when new content comes out) anymore.

    LOOK AT IT THIS WAY

    Let's say there is a new car manufacturer on the market and he is presenting his first couple car models in
    this nice big showroom. From the outside the cars look beautiful, sporty, the handling of the cars is
    spot on, and the sound, ohh man the sound of those machines is just heavenly. YOU JUST GOT TO HAVE ONE OF THOSE CARS!!! But then you take a closer look and find there are a lot of essential things missing on the cars, there are no backseats installed, the boot doesn't open, the headlights, horn, windscreen wipers
    don't work, there are no seat belts etc..., effectively not making one of the cars roadworthy.

    You mention this to the car manufacturer and they acknowledge the problem but tell you not to worry and
    that they are on top of the situation and to come back in a couple of weeks and everything will be fine.
    Sooo, a couple of weeks later you go back to the showroom, cash (checkbook, credit card) in your pocket,
    ready to buy on of these beauties, only to find out that the showroom is packed with even more different
    kinds of car models, but almost nothing has been done about the missing features on the existing (and new)
    models.

    To top it all of, even if you decide to go ahead and buy a car, you can not take the car home with you
    because the car only starts with a special kind of key that cannot leave the showroom. You have to leave
    the car there, go there every time you want to drive to pick up and drop of your car, and just hope they are not closed, never go out of business or disappear on you.

    NOW, WOULD YOU BUY A CAR FROM THAT CAR MANUFACTURER ??????


    One last thing. Stop promoting this game as free2play because it is NOT!
    It is a "game that comes with a free starter package" and an enormous freedom to choose which content you
    want to own or not. Simple.
     
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    Last edited: Oct 22, 2015
  2. Patrick Schilhan

    Patrick Schilhan Well-Known Member

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    Well, there is nothing to add in my mind. I think so too.
     
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  3. Vojvoda

    Vojvoda Well-Known Member

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    I understand that people are nervous, users expect new things into the simulator and never received a concrete answer, this produces new expectatives. Lots of questions don't have replies...
    IMHO, developers should told us what is their limit / objective (in simulator). The word "Soon" is not enough sometimes...
    On the other side, is obvious that simulator is going forward, step by step.
     
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  4. ::SKRO::

    ::SKRO:: Well-Known Member

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    Agree and added a few red notes.

    Now I'm confused. Wonder what not slowing down means.
     
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  5. Ernie

    Ernie Well-Known Member

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    I agree with many point of the TO. Most things are still in Top10 of my own wishlist for R3E.
    But saying that "just no progress happening with this game" is an exaggerated statement. A lot of great things were implemented the last few months. Nevertheless i really wish that some "basic things" (which already exist in older sims) will finally get its way into R3E. Otherwise everyone has different priorities, what things are most needed in R3E.;)
     
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  6. Emerson Meyer

    Emerson Meyer Well-Known Member

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    Step by step is not enough.
    The devs are trying to spread the idea that this game is JUST (!!) ONE year old. It's not.

    Two years under Simbin...one year under S3...

    This was supposed to be an EPIC update... Sorry, but IMHO it was just a necessary update, aiming the old stuff ...nothing breathtaking. Or am I missing something?

    After TWO major updates in this whole year, the core game is still the same... as said by @kris_peeters

    And to make the things worst, this approach is showing clearly a nefarious, (but no unexpected) result.
    There was no answer from the community regarding this update.

    Take a look at the steamcharts... the numbers are exactly the same as ever (low numbers). Nothing even close to what happened, for example, at the day and close after the release of 1.3 AC version.

    Now what?? At least 6 to 8 months to another update?? 6 to 8 months waiting for the core features....maybe, eventually??
     
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  7. mr_doedel

    mr_doedel Member

    Joined:
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    Sometimes it could help if S3 could think about a roadmap for the product and make this roadmap public
    to the community. Then everybody can see in what direction this baby walks.

    Hopefully not in that direction: Yeah next year another DTM2016 with ultra massive enhanced physics
    and guess what, then get the awesome fantastic DTM2017 .....

    I really looking forward for the open wheelers. Thats something new to RRE.

    I know NO race sim developer on this planet like to lern from other sims devs, but maybe S3 can do it like
    Codemaster with their fantastic timeline:
    https://www.dirtgame.com/uk/timeline

    So WE (the customers) can see in which directions the journey goes !
    If S3 choose the right direction, then more and more people jump into this sim.

    But maybe S3 is always surprised at the update release date what the core devs deliver :cool:
     
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  8. Frankymoe

    Frankymoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
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    Guys, keep calm :cool:

    Sim Bin made a lot of faults when starting with Raceroom. Sector 3 admited the mistake:
    “RaceRoom wasn't performing how we anticipated or expected: we launched with a very trimmed out version of the product – it was basically a hot lapping machine, and development wasn't going as quickly as we anticipated,”

    Now they have nearly repaired past mistakes within one year! They revised and updated the old physics (maybe GTR X Class is missing), we have a useful AI, the best Sounds, good graphics and a working Multiplayer with dedicated server.
    You shouldn`t forget this improvements! It`s a small team and they worked hard.

    I think the remaining car get new physics this year. When it is done S3 has set a perfect basis.
    And after that I would bet that we will get bit stops, damage model, ...

    You have two possibilities: complain all the time about things we don`t have or enjoy what we have and relax about the future!
    I prefer the second one! ;):p
     
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  9. 2Lame2Aime

    2Lame2Aime Well-Known Member

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    Even if I can understand some complains I have to say that giving us this great physics is enough for one update. At least it works and they haven't promised anything more.
    Look what Kunos did. They released 1.3 and totaly messed up GT3 class. That's a reason to complain.
     
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  10. James Cook

    James Cook Well-Known Member

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    Agree with the OP to a large extent although to say there is no progress is clearly unfair. The game has advanced substantially over the past 18 months or so but I think it's fair to say the development of core, fundamental features really hasn't kept pace. Whether that's a lack of resources or a case of different priorities - I don't know - but Sector3 has no trouble pumping out high quality content on a regular basis. The cynic in me says that is the business model. New content is king.

    Now, I appreciate that development is divided into separate, specialist teams and manpower is not necessarily transferable, but the fact that, after all this time, the most basic of settings are conspicuous by their absence doesn't sit well with me. Settings such as race distance by laps or a simple pit window option are two glaring omissions.

    I really hope the next update brings a focus on core features. New, shiny content is all well and good but a solid foundation is what will keep people playing R3E over the long-term and as it stands, R3E is built on shaky ground.
     
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  11. Gerbuho

    Gerbuho Well-Known Member

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    The only thing that keeps bothering is having to go to the dealer's place to drive my car, hoping it's not closed (with the known 503 sign on door).
     
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  12. Tuborg

    Tuborg Well-Known Member

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    YES!
     
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  13. phspok

    phspok New Member

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    Well this latest "update" is a bad joke, the steering even after a reset to defaults is now horrible, wooly, no "feel" to it anymore, we just had a league race : http://www.simracing.org.uk/smf/index.php?topic=13316.45
    and everyone's opinion is that the M1 procar has been neutered horribly, and no one likes the new steering system
    it is possible my own attempts to push this as a valid racegame are going to die soon if this terrible "downdate" is not fixed.
     
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  14. heppsan

    heppsan Well-Known Member

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    Agreed!!!
    Come on @J-F Chardon
    I think you have said yourself in some dev stream that you at least had plans of releasing a road map?.

    We are all grown ups here, we can handle and understand if there will be changes or hiccups in the roadmap.
    But would be really nice to at least see what the plans for now looks like, and when you expect to get those features in. (if everything goes as you plan)
     
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  15. Sean Kenney

    Sean Kenney Well-Known Member

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    Once some of the core racing features are in, people will be much more appeased. I just hope it doesn't come too late.

    Great game, needs a bit of a TURBO button, sort of speak, in development to put in the needed
    features.

    A lot of peoples posts about not making progress are beyond extreme which almost makes it farcical.
     
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  16. Christian G

    Christian G Topological Agitator Beta tester

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    Ignoring the major physics update and all the fixes for issues which also caused problems people were complaining about, I don't really understand how this isn't a fair list of features that have been requested by the community (some by more, some by less users).
    Guess you can't please 'em all at once...
    Just as a hint, many people were complaining about performance issues which in most cases were caused by shadows, and those are much better now. Idk, I guess I prefer a smooth and stable game over one that has blue flags but performs badly.
     
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  17. MeMotS

    MeMotS Well-Known Member

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    I agree with most of the original post. But also like what @James Cook said , its a bit unfair to say nothing is getting done.

    Yes some bigger core feature are needed but take a close look at everything that was in the patch notes. It's very very impressive.

    Keep up the good work sector 3 but I will also echo the sentiment that a road map for everyone to see would be appreciated.
     
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    Last edited: Oct 23, 2015
  18. J-F Chardon

    J-F Chardon Sector3 Producer Developer

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    Hello there!

    Just quickly posting about several points to confirm they are currently being worked on, most already done on c++ side by @Robert Holm and just only awaiting menu integration.

    • Saving car setups : done in code. Awaiting menu impl.
    • Fuel use / starting fuel / fuel management : being worked on, first code submitted yesterday
    • Manual pitstops : being worked on.
    • Forced pitstops with tire changes: submitted yesterday
    We're working on more things of course, but since those are listed in the OP I thought I'd come here and confirm.

    Again, small team means we have to target our efforts and sometimes push things to later a little. For example, the menu implementation of those has to wait until we're done on some side-products we have to deliver.
     
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  19. Gerbuho

    Gerbuho Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, I don't like the "new" M1 (was one of my faves). :(

    But... YEAH! Now I like Zolder again, and I like Monza again. :D (found a bug in Monza BTW, I'll report tomorrow).
     
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  20. shardshunt

    shardshunt Well-Known Member

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    cool:cool:! cant wait for setups and fuel!!!:)
    (id imagine your busy with bugs atm tho. squash those first!)
     
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