WTCC tires

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by pargiNOS, Mar 30, 2017.

  1. pargiNOS

    pargiNOS Well-Known Member

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    Hello
    I think since the February update, something has changed at WTCC tires, many of us don't manage to get 20 minutes races with out a flat tire. I was thinking it was me and my driving style, but when i encounter that issue many other racers had the same issue at RD club, some slower and some faster, so its not about aggression.
    The problem is bigger at online races, at SP races it is still there but not so much.
    These cars are my favorites and i know i didnt change my driving style the last month.

    Does anyone know anything about that?

    Thank you
     
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  2. GooseCreature

    GooseCreature Well-Known Member

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    Well after the next Patch (Flags) the following Patch will incorporate new tyre compounds according to a post by J-F Chardon over at RD.
    Hope that helps to assure you of a Rubbery future!
     
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  3. DreamsKnight

    DreamsKnight Well-Known Member

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    Could you link the post about tires? Sorry
     
  4. Balrog

    Balrog Well-Known Member

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    I'm not a huge fan of these high deg tyres anyway to be honest. I follow - and occasionally participate in - the two biggest WTCC leagues in my country and only a few people are capable of managing the tyres for 30-35 minutes in almost every location, everyone else is constantly complaining about the significance of tyre management over hard racing.

    And I know, an easy solution would be a pit stop near the middle of the stint, but when most of the races are 30 minutes long and your tyres last circa 25, it's just not worth it, so you end up with this slightly annoying experience on most of the circuits, when the last few minutes are about survival and survival only.
     
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  5. Andi Goodwin

    Andi Goodwin Moderator Beta tester

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    have you all tried not raping the toe and camber and setting it to a little less extreme?

    Andi
     
  6. rad

    rad Well-Known Member

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    Well, WTCC tires are designed to last for under 30min races
     
  7. Balrog

    Balrog Well-Known Member

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    Well, I know for a fact that Zengő uses race tyres from previous weekends during friday sessions (mainly because of budget limitations), so a high risk of a puncture after a 25 minute long session is a little too extreme in my opinion.
     
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  8. DreamsKnight

    DreamsKnight Well-Known Member

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    people want tyres pressures, but complain about the main things to do with tyres: managing them? :)
     
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  9. GooseCreature

    GooseCreature Well-Known Member

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  10. pargiNOS

    pargiNOS Well-Known Member

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    Its not a setup problem, i have tried with many setups, with the same result.
    Its not about aggression, me and someone around 2-3 seconds slower than me have the same issue.
    And unfortunately we are having the issue at 20min races.

    Its not only me, half of the grid have the same problem.
    Anyway thanks for the answers, we have to wait till next month patch with the tire compound to see if we can find a solution.
     
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  11. CheerfullyInsane

    CheerfullyInsane Well-Known Member

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    Indeed, I had the same problem. Two red tires after 20m race.
    Default set-up, and since this is FWD it's certainly not caused by me going fast. :D
     
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  12. Andy Kettler

    Andy Kettler Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    60Km distance per race... Tire management was always important in WTCC... :)
     
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  13. pargiNOS

    pargiNOS Well-Known Member

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    20 minutes race at Karlskoga is almost 50km. So to finish with flat tire is not normal.
    10 more Km is about 10 laps, so i would be happy to have that.

    Try to understand my issue. I race these cars 2 years now, i have that problem only after Februarys patch. Before that i was managing my tires and now i dont?
    I tried everything, change setup to more friendly, change steering rotation to be smoother, i did a check integrity, i delete the folder in my documents.
    Im not looking for someone to blame, maybe is me but then again is not only me.
    Im looking for a solution because i cant race at the 20 minute races we have at RD not knowing if i will finish the race.

    Thank you all, one more time, for your answers.
     
  14. nate

    nate Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    Which season is the problem? We have 3 WTCC seasons that are all somewhat different.

    As far as I know, no changes at all were made to the WTCC cars since the WTCC 15 season released last year.
     
  15. pargiNOS

    pargiNOS Well-Known Member

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    That was my first thought too, i have not seen any change at the changelog.

    I have not race the 13's for long time, so i dont know about those.
    The 14's have the bigger impact, 2 last races one at Nurburgring and one at Laguna, me and 4-5 racers, finish the races with flat tires.
    With the 15's i manage to finish the 20min race with completely empty red front tires, i had to drop my pace for the last 3 laps, one more lap and i would have a flat.

    We have done those races again in the past, with not a single issue.
     
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  16. Balrog

    Balrog Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, it's not a new thing, the tyre wear has been like this since the 2014 season released. And it is also track dependant, the Hungaroring is very nasty in this regard for example. The 2013 season with the old S2000 cars is perfectly fine, you can race hard for even 35-40 minutes. But tyre management is the key factor with the TC1 cars. I wouldn't call it an "issue", it just takes away a bit of fun from the races I think.
     
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  17. nate

    nate Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    Hmm alright, so for starters... it seems I cannot confirm any issues with the 2014 WTCC cars.

    Did a 30 min race at Hungaroring with 19 AI. Fuel/Tire wear at 1x, damage on, noon, and I used default setup. Qualified first because I only ran the AI at 100% :p

    Tire wear was a non-issue. I successfully completed the race with a time of 31:25, Completing 17 laps I believe. Race pace was low - mid 1:48's, with the best lap being 1:48.3xx. Not the fastest, but enough to mess around and see how the tires wear. Only issue I ran into was fuel. I would have run out of fuel before the 30 mins was over, so I had to pit and I took 10L. I went into the pits with ~2 mins left and 2L fuel left, and then completed 2 laps after this.

    2017-04-02 0259 0004.jpg

    According to the mini HUD, my tire wear display turned yellow with ~20 mins remaining.

    2017-04-02 0237 0001.jpg

    It turned orange with ~12 mins remaining.

    2017-04-02 0245 0002.jpg

    And it started flashing red with ~3 mins remaining. (This was right before I went into the pits, but I did not take new tires.)

    2017-04-02 0254 0003.jpg

    I reckon I had between 5-10% tire wear remaining, and had enough for 1-2 more laps which would put me at about ~35 mins before the tires would be at 0% and pop.

    So, WTCC 14 seems to be fine and I did not have any issues. I will check the WTCC 15 cars tomorrow perhaps.

    I imagine Andi is spot on with his assessment earlier though. Using asinine setup tweaks that exacerbate tire wear is a likely issue. So, if you are only getting 20 mins before the tires are dead, you are doing something really, really wrong. Either with setup changes, or by overdriving corners and oversteering, thereby sliding around the corners which does in fact seem to kill tires quicker than driving them normally without sliding.

    If you guys want to test this specific combo to see if your results are similar, that would be appreciated. I used the Lada, but all the cars in the class use the same tires, so this shouldnt matter.

    Edit: And for a comparison to the real world, the 2014 Race of Hungary lasted 14 laps (26 mins) and had a best race lap of ~1:51. So, For my tires to last ~31 mins without any problem, I think it is safe for me to say that there is no issue with this combo.

    Cheers
     
  18. Balrog

    Balrog Well-Known Member

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    That's pretty close to my pace and experience on a lonely stint. The problems start when you are in an actual multiplayer event with tight competition and you have to constantly attack and defend your position which results in some harder braking, sharper turning etc. and you realize the display turned yellow with ~22 minutes to go, then already turned orange with ~15 minutes remaining and so on, and finally you end up with letting the faster guys by and just managing your pace till the end, altough you had no issues before against the AI.:D But as I said, it's not a real issue, I just don't like these high deg tyres. The 2013 ones allow a more aggressive driving style.:)
     
  19. nate

    nate Well-Known Member Beta tester

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    I wouldnt necessarily say they are high-deg tires. They are only designed to be run for the WTCC race distances, not really any further. So, ~25 mins on most WTCC tracks, or ~30 mins on a track like Shanghai.

    I did 17 laps at Hungaroring and the real race there in 2014 did 14. Im not sure anyone driving "hard" would be able to completely kill these tires in 14 laps unless they are doing something really wrong as mentioned. I was doing some dumb things like sliding around some corners and still went 17 laps with no problem.

    Not saying there isnt any issue here (although I dont see one with the 2014 cars), just that they shouldnt be expected to go far beyond what the actual race distance and race times of their respective WTCC season was. :)
     
  20. pargiNOS

    pargiNOS Well-Known Member

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    Thx for trying!!! With the AI the problem is not that big. I can finish the race. The problem is at online races.
    My friend im racing with these cars for over a year and i never had that issue. the issue started for us at RD club races, after February patch. I have not change my driving style the last month. I use the default set up for testing and i have the same results.
    The tires goes yellow after 8min goes orange after 12min and goes to red almost after 15min.
    I have tried with Honda and Chevy.
    And i say that again. Its not just me and my pace. Slower drivers mid-pack drivers have the same issue.

    I dont want to cause any trouble, i just want to drive my favorite cars.