It's a bit hard to describe for me, the Ai brakes later than you, but the Ai brakes way too much and is slower in corner entries than you. Overall they match your race speed. They have more speed, because of later braking but they also lose speed while they brake too hard. Normally you don't do a full stop in corner entries like the Ai does often, you use some speed to get into the corner and you use that momentum to accelerate out of it. The problem is, you can't adapt to it because you can't brake in the same way as the Ai does. IMO they "just" have to finetune the braking points of the Ai and make them more aware of other cars
I won't deny that there might be sth going wrong with AI braking, I don't have the insight to judge that. I was just pointing out that when people say they are braking at the same time as the AI does, they actually might not brake at the same time because when you see them brake you're already behind by 0.x seconds and that is a significant amount at speeds >200 and that that is bound to fail for the reason I laid out before. In my test-driving I found that if I modulate the brakes carefully instead of just slamming them to the metal they work better, which is why I assume that's what the AI does too, they operate the brakes at their optimal stopping power constantly and thereby achieve maximum deceleration and reduce their braking distance compared to us/me. But as so often with AI, it is being looked at and maybe the devs are doing things to improve the AI's braking, so it looks more... human.
That isn't enough. I made 3 videos of the typical Ai moves. In the first, you can clearly see that I almost brake at the same time as the Ai and i was full on the brakes at 100%. These cars have ABS so I shouldn't have to lift the brake to brake better. You can see that I still had a lot of speed as I crashed into the car and there was enough room that it should give me a bonus. Until this point I had the same speed as the Ai and the Ai also had another car infront, so it can't be slipstream only. The second one shows the Ai bashing me off the road for no reason and I was right on the side of the car. The third one shows two bad Ai moves. First the Ai crashes into me with full speed and I couldn't move anywhere else, there was a car right infront of me, and seconds later I overtook the Ai and the Ai also didn't care and moved right into me, there was no reason for that. These 3 things have to be sorted out or raceroom can only be a hotlap sim since the multiplayer is kinda... dead. That was on adaptive Ai, and oh boy adaptive Ai is the worst. It's not adaptive at all. I deleted my Ai setting file and started fresh. I did 3 races. On the first, I laped the Ai twice. On the second, I laped half the field once. On the third I won with a few seconds to second. Then I did another 4 races and the Ai totally drove away from me. I finished all races, even as last and even after 4 races they have been way too strong and I feel all it does is setting an intern percentage like 120%. The Ai doesn't adapt to your speed, or to your brake behaviour or anything else. Adaptive Ai is not the answer to the Ai problems. It's like an even bigger problem.
I wont say the AI is perfect because clearly it's not, but I will say it's pretty good for what it is and gets the job done pretty well. The first vid... There might be a few things to think about. You were clearly in the draft behind the car in front of you, so your downforce was reduced. This could either extend your braking distance or make you brake slightly less stable. The AI in front of you may have just braked perfectly. Im not sure if this particular class of AI is programmed to brake slightly better than is possible than the player car, but I know other classes arent, as I have asked about this before. The 2nd vid is clearly an issue however, and the devs are actively working on making the AI more aware of the player car, and other cars around them. This is probably one of the trickiest parts of AI behavior to code though... since it delves so heavily into human-like behavior... knowing where your opponent is on track, knowing how much room to leave, respecting their space. All while maintaining pressure and 'racing'. I've been bumped before exactly like this, but it is just something that happens while the devs constantly work to improve things. Perhaps it will be better this next patch, perhaps not. But it is being worked on. The 3rd vid... I would rather objectively say both incidents are your fault. The first incident you had a poor line off of the racing line, while the AI was properly tucked down on the inside, in preparation of the next corner. You then came across the AI and drove over into him. I mean, you really cut across and pinched him when he was already next to the wall. Perhaps the angle from behind the cars would show this more clearly, but you didnt leave space. The 2nd incident in forrest elbow... The AI was in front of you and inside on the turn. He slipped up slightly but maintained control as you were attempting the pass on the outside. Again, you cut down low and pinched him when he was next to you. You werent clear when you tried to make a move like that. So, he touched your rear because you drove into him again. Play this clip back with an angle from behind. Look at where you started the turn (near the white line on the outside) and look at where you made contact... Nearly on the white line on the inside. Adaptive AI doesnt work properly until it "learns" your relative pace. To do this, you need to go through qualifying and race sessions to get it to 'match' your pace. The first race with adaptive AI is poor, but it will learn to match your speed over time. Not only that, but I believe you have to go through this process for each class of cars. Not just once and expect it to work with every class. I cant recall all of the finer details on how it learns your pace, so perhaps @Christian Göpfert can share his insight.
The more I watch the 3rd video I am not sure whos fault it was, but the Ai behind me could have used it's brakes in the first case just like everyone else would. Unfortunately I didn't upload the whole record, there was only one way I could go and it was the on the right side. You take this corner in second gear, it's not high speed. It's not a problem at all to brake there and avoid a crash. The second situation, it could be me or the Ai again. The thing is, the Ai could have also used it's brake instead of pushing into me with full force like an ocean tanker. I only have a single monitor so it's impossible for me to see what is left or right from me. All I have is the spotter App. On the adaptive Ai thing. I only drive my McLaren GT3 no other car. I was shoked as the Ai was 4 seconds faster than I am in qualify, 4 times in a row. How ofter do I have to become last place for the Ai to adapt downwads?
Well I never restarted a race because of the AI but shore have because of my own driving is not relaxed and litle to eger to get ahead.. causing crashes left and right.. Think mostly when I race AI I try to push the limits alot to learn to controll the situations when things not go as planed... and that is what I use AI for most of the times. I have them set to 101% or more sometime I set them to addaptive but resently I think I need to reset the adaptive part for they are like F1 on steroids now ha ha ha... Think they need to relearn
I'm not sure it can be easily explained away using the draft effect (and I'm not suggesting that is what you are trying to do). Other sims simulate this effect yet I don't find myself bumping into the back of AI cars nearly as much as I do in R3E. It looks to me as though the AI cars' rate of deceleration increases toward the end of the braking zone whereas the players rate of deceleration remains more or less constant. The same occurs when braking side-by-side with an AI car where there is no slipstream effect at work - my braking isn't as effective which means I can carry more speed into a corner. Great for overtaking but not so good when close behind an AI car. Also note the funky collision physics which means the player's car invariably goes into a spin even though it's the one hitting the back of another car.
Have to comment the videos it'll be short and consist.. 1st one is your fault, you are coming from behind you carry the responsibility to drive accordingly to what you have ahead clearly you didn't, way to fas in behind not consider the draft or what is in front of the AI you crashed in to... I call it not looking ahead far enough.. 2nd one it is your fault, coming from behind it is always your fault if you crash in someone in front. Unless they deliberately try to block you and force you off.. which is not the case here.. 3d one shore is an aggressive move from the AI but totally corect, you do not have the line there he does and he keep it forcing you to to stay where you are... nice move and nothing wrong there, aggressive yes but totally fair move. Edit: I do agree with James and the funky collision physics, that I think is something they realy need to work on hard.. for it is way wrong.. but I see why they have done it so it is to prevent wreckers from behind and punish them insted of the one in front..
Having ABS doesn't mean you can slam the brakes instantly and hold them down 100%. At least I think so I brake earlier than most people online and manage to do relatively fine. Could it be that the AI's brakes and tyres are always working at optimum temps? I remember vanilla GTR2 would have the AI braking much better than a human. Tweaking the AI settings in the .plr files could fix it, but it needs to be set differently for different types of cars, so maybe that's a compromise by the devs. Finally, fully agree that the crash physics are wonky but again, I think that is a compromise for AI car stability. Shift 2, GTR2 and RACE all had AI that you couldn't move and Shift had you spinning out wildly just by a touch. In GTR2 you could make the cars looser by lowering some extra torque values but sometimes that would make the AI unable to control their cars in certain scenarios. edit: Last video, I would've nailed you both times if you did that in front of me. Just sayin'
Adaptive AI only adapts during race sessions, not quali or practice. And you have to be pretty consistent, otherwise the system will record laptimes that spread too much and the average it calculates will be less accurate. For me they are pretty much on par after three short races or one 30 minute (or longer) race.
Maybe you want to try it out yourself. If I brake earlier the car behind me would overrun me with full force because it brakes at the same time as the car in front of me. Not sure what my fault is in the second one. I am behind. YES, but I go in for an overtake move, nothing wrong with that. The front car can't just change positions like it wants. I also had situations where I was right next to the other car on a straight line and it just pushed me off the road like I wasn't there. The third one, Yes as I said could be my fault too but it was also caused by the Ai in front of me braking way too hard in that corner, still the Ai behind me could be aware of "no room" and also use the brakes. Still at the end this could be totally my fault but it's still a game. I am not in a real race car. I don't have the view like in a real race car and the Ai should be coded to take this human lack of information in mind. Because - you all know what you see in an McLaren GT3 with FOV 8 on a single monitor, nothing but black bars on the left. I did 15 races now between 15 and 30 min with qualify. Nothing changed. The Ai still does alienlike times like only the best drivers on the leaderboard do (Zandvoor 1:37.2) I couldn't even catch the last car. I finished in the last row so many times now. It should be better already. Maybe I just delete the file again and start over. I am sure that this would have never happened vs real drivers. Please people always take in mind, we talk about Ai and not about real life players here. I read a lot comments saying "act like they are real drivers" and I already try that but the Ai does so many weird stuff a real player wouldn't do. I know from Assetto and iRacing that real people would never brake or move on the track like the Ai does.
Regarding to the 1st Vid: If I remember right, the Braking-Behavior of the AI was changed a bit in a way that the lift of from throttle and coast a bit before they really start to brake. In addition to that, the GT3-Cars behave different on the Brakes, some are better, some lesser. And not to forget the Brake-Balance can make a difference too.
Well that certainly doesn't sound right, something's going wrong there. But you said it did change before, right? If you care to answer I'd appreciate: Do you run RR in admin mode? Do you have the game installed on a different partition/drive than the OS, and which version of Win are you using? Can you check whether your Win account has sufficient permissions to write in the documents folder and/or that the aiadaptation.xml isn't write protected/read only?
Sure I'll give you all the info you need. No problem Christian 1. Yes I run it in admin mode, yes it changed before, the Ai was super weak first then the Ai got stronger and now it's an alien 2. Windows 10, I installed raceroom via steam. I have 2 steam folders. One on my SSD thats C: where my OS is installed, and the other on my HDD thats D: raceroom is installed on D: 3. The aiadaptation.xml was last written 1 hour and 20 minutes before. That fits the time of my last lost race. I uploaded the file, if you want to take a look into it.
Thanks a lot for answering those questions and for uploading the file, I'll have a look. That means you have two steam installations and user accounts? Or is it possible to split one library?
One account. It's possible to create multiple steam/game folders. http://i.stack.imgur.com/RYWFx.png ^ picture I found on google.
Yes that is not problem at all. In steam| settings | downloads ... you can manage that. You can even install multiple times steam on your machine. So have i in one steam installation multiple drives and in another steam installation my beta and WIP version of different games.
Didn't know that was possible. Thanks, I live and I learn. One thing that just crossed my mind, Those races you mentioned, did you do them on the same track (Zandvoort you mentioned)? Cause adaptation is class/track based, meaning they have to adapt to you from scratch at each track and with each class. Had a quick look and found just a few adaptation values, very few actually. One also looked like the value used for the AI strength was indeed about 5 seconds faster than the laptimes recorded from you... Definitely not as it should look I suppose. I'm no dev tho, so I can't make any definitive statements, just telling you what I'm seeing and judging it by my layman experience.
I did like 6/7 races on Brands Hatch (GT3, won 3, lost rest) After that I tried 2 races (Radical SR9, lost hopelessly) Then I switched for I think 3 races to Bathurst (GT3, lost hopelessly) The rest I did on zandvoort (GT3, lost hopelessly) In all GT3 races I used the McLaren. Maybe you could give me a guide "how to adaptive Ai" and I will follow it tomorrow with a fresh file.