I wish R3E had some kind of training mode - like GTR2, only with the freedom to have custom start, finish and target lap times. While GTR2's training mode is good in the sense that you get to (for example) try a single turn over and over and over and over and over and over (and over...) again, until you feel you can consistently beat the target, what it lacks is the ability set any piece of track starting from anywhere and ending anywhere else for training, so that, if you blew your braking point or spun out, you could just start again immediately and not wait for a minute and a half to try again. Practice sessions as they are currently implemented are good for consistent racers who already have nailed the basics down, but for us noobs it's just as important to just drill the same basic stuff over and over until it starts to work, before we can try and attack lap times.
Although I did dabble with GTR2 back in the day, my neither I nor my set-up was serious enough to do it justice - so I'm unfamiliar with the Training mode you mention. What does stick with me however, is the Proving Ground from TOCA2 - that was a great open-world area with a skid pan, an oval (without fail I would always bin it on the banking - I blame the keyboard steering), fast bits, slow bits, twisty bits etc. The beauty of it was they were all linked together, like a real-world testing facility. So if you could pick the corner(s) you wanted to practice on, then use the service roads to make it into a short circuit and just keep hammering around. I'd love to see something like that
Having a free-form "proving grounds" track would be great too, but that's not quite what i mean. What i mean is, if, say, you always blow your breaking point at a particular turn on a particular track, you could set up your session to be "pick a car, start here, end here, start at this speed (rolling or no), beat this time", and then just do that, over and over again. Without going round the track after each failed attempt, without anything inbetween your attempts at beating that turn - just hit "retry" and go again immediately, from the same starting position. it's a difference between attempting the same turn once a minute, and attempting it 5 or 10 times a minute - that's five times the practice for the same amount of time! I know it's not really "realistic" practice, but it's a computer game - we can forego limitations of real life if it makes sense!
Yeah, I see what you mean about a specific corner, I thought you just meant corners in general lol. I always struggle with the section between the two Karussell corners on the nordschleife, but as you say, it's another 9 or 10 mins (or 15 with my driving!) before I can have another go
In fact this feature is almost There All ready. Leaderboard Challenge is a perfect way to train the first corner. Only chance could be, That in stead of fixed restart conditions(coordinates speed etc.), it is user defined. maybe as a "safe as restart point" when driving. (then saved conditions of Car would be the New restart conditions)
there is a way in raceroom to practice a track , its not how you want it but i think its a good way first choose the track you want enter a sp race and just do a quali lap /no fuel no damage no tyre wear etc do 3 laps look at your best time , now go to leaderboards choose the same track car combo pick a time thats a second faster make sure you have ghost and racing line on try to beat the time if you do find a time 1 second ahead repeat repeat repeat this way you get faster you learn the fastest lines if your no good at setups , do it in Am mode Andi
Again, the problem isn't getting a ghost track or practicing a track, the problem is practicing a particular corner on said track. What you're suggesting, works only for practicing the entire track, and not a particular area of that track. Right now, if i want to practice a particular corner, i have to waste a lot of time trying to get back to that corner once i make an attempt - that is, turn around, or finish the lap, or restart the race and drive to that corner again, or what have you. There is no easy way, akin to GTR2 driving school, to quickly do the same corner many times in a row, concentrating on just getting it right and not spending time to get there again. Think of it like GRID's fladhbacks, only infinite and serving a particular purpose.
Well, you don't need to practice one corner over and over. In all honesty, I think you're going about this the wrong way. Instead of practising one corner, try looking at what TYPE of corner it is. There aren't all that many kinds. T4 at Zandvoort and T8 at Nürburgring are pretty much the same corners, or at least close enough. So suddenly, instead of having to memorize each corner on each track, you can get by by memorizing 5-6 types of corners, and then only have to remember what variations to them are on each track. It gets much easier that way. It's a question of minimizing the mental strain. I had the same problem when I first started driving the Nords. I simply couldn't remember which gear I was supposed to be in for each corner, there were far too many corners for me to store in memory. Until I started assuming that every corner was a 3rd gear corner. Suddenly I only had to memorize the handful of corners that weren't.
You're not listening. Your post, wittingly or not, carries with it an assumption of a certain skill level already being present, not to mention the fact that the concept of practice relies on isolating the element one wants to practice. I won't repeat myself. There's a reason why GTR2 driving school worked so well.
I know this is going a bit off-topic (sorry...) but working on a single corner (or even type of corner) won't get the results you want. Arriving at a corner in a controlled and predictable way, and learning to optimise the braking, turn-in, apex and exit phases from this start point kinda misses the point. You need to learn to optimise a corner from any of the random start points that happen in a race. This means arriving at different speeds, in a car's slipstream, arriving off-line (sometimes way off line), arriving when you're tired, distracted, full of red-mist, sh!tting yourself because of the cars in the mirror. Basically all the stuff that happens in a race. Turning lap after lap just to nail that one corner you keep messing up sounds like a waste of time, but it teaches you how to improvise because your approach will vary (and it's a good idea to practice this deliberately, especially being off line). It's this improvisation that is so important.
I would very much like that feature. A quick fix could be just to alter the way leader board works. Wish for development : Make a training session that is exactly the same as the leaderboard challenge. Only difference is user defined restart conditions. Restart conditons: Speed, coordinates, etc. Could be generated by a "save as restart conditions" while driving Additional Wish for development: User defined end conditions. Just to understand you right Burillo. Isnt that pretty much what you suggest?
yes, kind of, except i don't think having a ghost is necessary for this (and it probably would be kinda hard to implement). again, you're missing the point. before you can "optimize" this or that, there needs to be something to optimize, some kind of a base line. you can't build your auxiliary skills (approaching the corder from random start points, different speeds, etc.) on this if there's no foundation to build on. when you're starting out, there are too many variables and too many things to take care of to make meaningful progress quickly. i take it you never practiced musical instruments? let me tell you a story as well. i started with GT Legends. max difficulty, no assists, a Mini cup. being a noob that i am, i got slaughtered in the first race. i qualified five seconds behind the lead, and full three seconds behind the next guy. then, i went to GTR2 and fired up driving school, and ran "braking" exercises for more than an hour. i drilled, and i drilled, and i drilled, until i was more often than not getting "gold", and consistently beating the AI ghost car. i came back to GTL the next day, and by the end of my practice session, i qualified for pole time. didn't do anything between GTR2 driving school and my GTL session. so, how do you think i was able to shave off five seconds of my time, if all i did was practice a single corner, on an unrelated track, on a GT3 Lotus (vs. a Mini in GTL), over and over again? to quote one of the posters above, it's because the corners on GTL track were kinda similar to the one i practiced in GTR2. so, i figured out how to that corner, and then was able to "adapt" and "optimize" that knowledge, just as you described. i learned one corner, i learned all of them, but i still have to learn one. see what i mean? this is how practice works - you isolate the element you want to practice, and you drill it, endlessly and disregarding all the other things. once you're comfortable with it and can do it without concentrating too much, then you can try and connect this isolated element to the rest of your technique, just like you said. this is why i'm saying posts like yours assume that there is already a base skill level, which might not be present. i know the corners are mostly similar track to track, that's not the issue. the issue is that sometimes i just don't know how to run through that particular type of corner, and would like a practice mode (as opposed to endless hotlapping which wastes a lot of time) to nail down the technique. you can't try minute differences in technique if it takes 1-2-3-5-10-15 minutes to try the corner again, with a different technique.
It is a game not real life, why not use the possibilities within that. Totally agree with this. I think you will agree on this. You actually know what to do, just turn the ghost on challenging the fastest driver But knowing that alone wont make you faster, Practice will I also know how to play the piano, since I can read the nodes, but knowing that alone wont make me play. Practice will. This is why the suggested feature would be so nice, so you can repeat over and over again the excact thing, you want to be better at..
Okay, so by that logic, if you're able to learn practical cornering by doing a driving school practice, and then carry that knowledge through to another sim, and adapt from there, then surely you're also able to carry that knowledge through to another sim, R3E in this case? I'm willing to bet vital parts of my anatomy to the fact that had you simply kept practising the GTL track (all of it) over and over again like you did with the driving-school, you would've gotten the same result. I mean, I'm not against the idea as such, even if I'll never use it. But considering that no other sim (to my knowledge) has done anything even remotely similar since GTR2, I'd venture the statement that it is perhaps not a cost-effective use of programming resources.
To my knowing in all other activities sport etc. you isolate elements if possible and train them separately and the you get better. Why do you want "to bet your vital parts of your anatomy" this is not true in simracing?
Running on a treadmill is unrealistic - where is the air resistance? - and yet many race drivers do it. Pilots practice landing and take off on multi-million dollar simulators, skipping eight hour flight times. The UK motorcycle test requires you to ride in a figure of eight around cones....never had to do that in all my years on the road! Even drummers aren't dumb enough to play a whole song just to practice a single fill. Yes, I saw the smiley, Johnny, but some people may agree with the content rather than the intent of your comment. My reply is for their benefit. As the OP says rudiments have to be isolated in order to focus on them. So although I have always been too impatient to get on track and race to give the training sessions any more than the barest minimum effort, I am beginning to wish I had. So I believe it was a fair suggestion. Properly marketed, it could encourage a few more casual gamers into the racing genre....... As we don't have that option though, the other advice is also good.
Don't agree when its only a corner. I agree when it comes to a sector. I want to compare it to music, wich is a subject im good enough to talk about. A Song (racetrack) has a intro, refrain etc. (Sector on racetrack) an these parts contain Chords (cornes).Shure u can play one Single chord over and over again to train. Than the other and so on. But if you want to play Songs un needed a fluent switching between the chords. And the Best way is to play the parts (sure not the whole song) in a row, Not single chords. First it will sound unclear, but you get used to the speed and rhytmn, and later the Sound (laptime) will get better. In the other way round it migth Sound clear but you will have a hard time to play it fast. If you want play acdc proberly -rhytmn is everything chords are (nearly) nothing (bc very easy). To translate it. You can have a hard Track with easy corners, because only combined they are hard to master. For me it Works that way in music. To race a single sector would bei nice, but is not a Feature i want too soon. There are other more important things
Racers or dastards? There was something similar: Apex Hunt! It's no more covered due to a lack of participation(?). So I don't give it a chance. Edit: btw, in the time you are writing this, you can make three laps on Nords and learn the track.
that is correct, yes. however, no other game has this mode, and GTR2 driving school's focus is a little bit different. as far as i'm aware, R3E is the only racing game that's currently in active development where developers aren't assholes and actually listen to people on forums. since it's the only game i could influence by suggesting this idea, it's kind of obvious why i started this thread. yes, and guess what? I've spent about two hours practicing that track in GT Legends prior to that. I've improved my time from "20 seconds behind because i constantly hit the grass", to "5 seconds behind because i stopped hitting the grass" about 15 minutes into the session. The rest of the time i spent stuck at "5 seconds behind the leader", because i was braking into first (and last) corner incorrectly - way too early, way too hard, way too wobbly with the wheel. it took me an hour of drilling the same turn over and over in GTR2 to realize that perhaps i shouldn't be so cavalier with the brake pedal. however, i'm now in a similar "rut" on the next track in GTL - i've been practicing it for hours, and my time has only marginally improved once i learned the track enough to not end up on the grass every lap. if i could take the turn where i know i suck and lose all my speed, and drill it hundreds of times in quick succession, it would improve my time drastically, for much less time spent. i am unable to quickly figure out what kind of mistakes i make because i can't fire the same turn over and over in quick succession, trying things and adjusting my technique accordingly. practice is a feedback cycle - if there's no feedback, it's not nearly as effective as it could be.